I've just grabbed this off ebay for the son's '70 beetle.
Obviously it bolts straight up to the body using the holes for the bumper bar. Is this the normal set up?
Just seems to me that bolting it to panels that aren't really meant to be load bearing could be asking for problems.
Well my friends are gone & my hair is grey, I ache in the places where I used to play.
Hi
All the type3's I have had and the beetle were set up this way, A friends is set up this way on his beetle and has had no trouble.
Marc
If you can't laugh at yourself you can't laugh at anyone else! Because life is to short not to LAUGH
And not too many of them fell off!! Only 4 M8 bolts held them on the Type 3.
DH
[ Edited on 25/5/2006 by 1500S ]
All the Beetle towbars I have had and seen, attach to the rear torsion bar arms go across under the engine to the centre of the bumper then across to the bumper mounting brackets on the bumper itself....
I'm thinking of fitting one of these to MY Beetle in the future, as it can stop a lot of damage if someone runs into the rear of Your beetle....
I did have a towbar on a Type 3 variant back in the 70s and it may have just bolted to the bumper brackets...
I can't really remember....
but I've only ever towed a trailer....
I believe the type 3 body is much more solid in the rear than a beetle....
A beetle's rear body... isn't very substantial ... or strong..
Lee
- Helping keep Air Cooled VWs on the road - location: SCONE in the Upper Hunter Valley - Northern NSW 320 kms NNW of SYDNEY---
Don't try and tow start another car or tow anything more than about the size of a garden trailer or you might end up stretching the rear with kinks at the top edges of the engine bay.
Cheers.
Excentric (wife says) VW nut, having owned 250+ VWs in 40 years.
Double joint rear end Type 3 vehicles only had the towbar bolted to the bumper mounts. Swing axle types had extra pipes clamped to fork just in front of the gearbox mount. Didn't really do much to the strength and nothing noticeable re damage unless vehicle had rear repairs.
Many Bugs pulled similar size vans if they were running 1500 engines. 6 x 4 box trailers on anything isn't a problem unless you have a rust bucket!
DH
[ Edited on 25/5/2006 by 1500S ]
I wouldn't be towing much with that towbar on a beetle
maybe a small trailer with very little weight...
or though You will probably get away with it on smooth roads with no jolting etc of the trailer....
best of Luck
Lee
- Helping keep Air Cooled VWs on the road - location: SCONE in the Upper Hunter Valley - Northern NSW 320 kms NNW of SYDNEY---
you need something like this attached to it...
this one attaches to the forks, but as other people have said, the torsion tube is a better place.
[ Edited on 25-5-2006 by pete wood ]
[ Edited on 25-5-2006 by pete wood ]
one more pic...
where the bar bolts to the bumper a strip of steel should go between the bumper mounts, but you already have that. just make up some tube work to go up to the torsion tubes.
I recently bought a 73 Beetle with one of those tow bars attached. It was removed when I tidied the car up and it will not go back on without strong extra tubes that attach it to the rear torsion bar tubes as well as the bumper. I agree with the others who say that a light load is OK but be very wary of towing a heavy load, as the rear bumper bolts are not really strong enough.
Just look at the short length of leverage as it is if a load bounces up and down at the towball. It would tear right out of the car. Extend the leverage to the rear torsion bar tubes or to the front of the engine forks and it become much stronger.
As the load "bounces up and down on the towball" the majority of load is on the 4 bolts (or whatever the Bug has) holding the bumper to the vehicle. These towbars served well carrying normal size trailers on both Type 1 and Type 3 vehicles without many adverse effects on the bodyworks. I am posting my thoughts on the strength of these setups from actual experience, not what some "may think" what could happen. If the body of the vehicle is in good condition, bolt the thing on and use it with normal care and you will not have any problems.
The 1964 Type 3 in pic towed that small van to QLD and return to Sydney and also spent many kms in front of a 7 x 4 box trailer. A later 72 S/B towed a heavier 4 berth van some distance around Victoria as well as the same size box trailer over the years with only the 4 M8 high tensile bolts holding things together.
Hope that actual experience will boost your confidence!
DH
I'm not talking of towing anything substantial with a beetle anyway, I got the kombis for that.
Beetle towbars that I have seen have looked like Pete's pictures, but even they look like pressure would be in the same place.
The actual pulling part is your floorpan, but downward pressure is still squarely on you bumper bar mountings.
Might just get a mate of mine to put a couple of brackets on it bolting up to the box mounts.
Hedge my bets.
Well my friends are gone & my hair is grey, I ache in the places where I used to play.
With the Bug type Pete has posted, there is very little strength left where the pipes have been flattened and curve bent to attach to the fork brackets. If you look at the moment arm from the towball to the attachment point of the bumper brackets, there is very little stress on the pipes going to the fork. As the towbar gooseneck rotates down under vertical loads it would actually try to push the pipes forward. Likewise, as the vehicle starts to pull the load, due to the position of the attachment bolt to the crossbar, it will also cause rotation which will push the pipes forward.
With all of this in mind, the only time there will be a tensile load on those pipes is if the rear end stretches or if the 4 bumper bracket bolts shear or maybe under severe braking with a heavy load! (Think about it!)
Ah to hell with the theory of mechanics! It's strong enough for what you want. I'm sure that when these towbars were designed that there was some specs in the books which gave towball loads as well as a maximum towed weight.
DH
Spook,
That is exactly the sort of towbar Ive been looking for to put on my beetle, as with all the other types you are basically stuck with only one choice of exhaust system, that being the factory muffler, extractors all interfere with the tubes that run back to the torsion housing or frame horns.
Does anyone have one the same as Spook that they want to unload?
Cheers
Brendan
Calling all NSW Mid North Coast Veedubbers
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my 74 1300 came with one and i towed an empty car trailer with it and it did it fine
it was just bolted to the bumper mounts like that one
cept i forgot to take it off when i scrapped it
i didnt think they were worth anything
Joel
spook I have 1 beetle one the same and 2 type 3 ones.I thought the same as you.But speaking to a friend who tows a small teardrop caravan on the back of a beetle he has no problem.{YET}
1500S wrote:With the Bug type Pete has posted, there is very little strength left where the pipes have been flattened and curve bent to attach to the fork brackets. If you look at the moment arm from the towball to the attachment point of the bumper brackets, there is very little stress on the pipes going to the fork. As the towbar gooseneck rotates down under vertical loads it would actually try to push the pipes forward. Likewise, as the vehicle starts to pull the load, due to the position of the attachment bolt to the crossbar, it will also cause rotation which will push the pipes forward.
With all of this in mind, the only time there will be a tensile load on those pipes is if the rear end stretches or if the 4 bumper bracket bolts shear or maybe under severe braking with a heavy load! (Think about it!)
Ah to hell with the theory of mechanics! It's strong enough for what you want. I'm sure that when these towbars were designed that there was some specs in the books which gave towball loads as well as a maximum towed weight.
DH
I never said it was the best setup. But it give you a general idea of where you should be headed. BTW, I think the pipesare flat from too many bangs and scrapes as much as from deliberate shaping.
Hi Pete. The pipes where they are flattened and bend up to the clamps look fairly close to original. I think the flats you mention is shown in tb2 where it has had a few low passes half way along. My brother had a new bug back in 1964 with a towbar fitted as new. Later on when I went Type 3 I actually drew and made the early Type 3 bar from a sample at Lennox Motors at Blacktown (it paid off to have a mate who was the spare parts manager there!). At one stage, the pipe assembly was left off and it didn't make any difference on the Notch but as the Bugs have a flat bar instead of the larger tube inside the bumper it would need the other bits for some strength.
Anything new in P and P'less at B'town?
DH
i think i have a torsion bar setup tow bar as 68autobug mentioned if you or anyone else wanted?
ill take some pics this weekend if i can
nick
Spook do you mind if I use your picture so I can post a Wanted Add?
Cheers
Brendan
Calling all NSW Mid North Coast Veedubbers
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1500S wrote:Anything new in P and P'less at B'town?
DH
there was a kombi camper in the processing yard the other day. Haven't been inside the main yard for a few months now.
🙁Special Air Service wrote:Spook do you mind if I use your picture so I can post a Wanted Add?
Cheers
Brendan
Once it's on the net it becomes public domain doesn't it?
But if you want my ok, go for it.
Well my friends are gone & my hair is grey, I ache in the places where I used to play.
Thanks Mate, Ive just seen noses out of joint over similar things before.
Cheers
Brendan
Calling all NSW Mid North Coast Veedubbers
Click Below
