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noisey Valves

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Ian Bugden AKA - Bugs

248 posts · joined May 2003 ·

#599037
Hi,
I have recently (yesterday) adjusted the valves on my 36hp beetle and they seem to be noisier now that before. I adjusted them to .006" which I know is the specs for all later engines but I could not find and specs for the 36hp. I have double checked them and everthing but now they seem to be a bit louder that before, in particular the LHS ones.

Any suggestions?? is .006" the right clearance?

The valves were done cold so you can eliminate that.

Cheers.

Ian Bugden
A good friend will come and bail you out of jail.....
But a true friend will be sitting next to you saying "Damm that was fun!!!"

jo_tas Custom Title Time!

1,547 posts · joined Aug 2004 ·

#599038
Were they tight before?

Craig Torrens 6 times Australian, 7 times State Hillclimb Class Champion

8,040 posts · joined Jan 2003 ·

#599040
36hp are .004"


vw54 Administrator Always Waiting 4 Friday

16,723 posts · joined Aug 2002 ·

#599052
use 0.006" better and VW approved for all engines

Did you take out the adjuster screws and remove or re round the faces of the tappet so there no gaps and you have 2 clean faces to set the clearence gap to.

sometimes theres an excessive gap when the tappet screws isnt sitting flat against the valve stem
I read it on FACEBOOK so it must be true


http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=91278&page=1#pid848630


http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=63561&page=1#pid624099


http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=4832&page=1#pid452603


http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=60650&page=1#pid574409

Ian Bugden AKA - Bugs

248 posts · joined May 2003 ·

#599230
Hi,
The valve train was strarting to get a little noisy hence why I thought I would do the adjustment. Some seemed tight, others felt loose. I haven't checked if they are long studs or short studs that hold the rocker ass. as I have heard and read that the clearance needs to be different.

What makes the valve noisy, is it too much clearance or too little? I know tight valves will ruin the valve seats.

Ian.
A good friend will come and bail you out of jail.....
But a true friend will be sitting next to you saying "Damm that was fun!!!"

MickH Hairy Gutted Sloth

3,389 posts · joined Sep 2003 ·

#599234
To much clearance will make them noisy.Not trying to be a smartass..but did you do them in the right order ?? ie... compression stroke TDC on number 1 and 180 degree rotation BACKWARDS to do number 2 etc etc..? Setting them to 006 is the way to go. If it was me I'd be trying to do them again and double checking everything:beer
tssnq.com.au

type3lover in the garage...

796 posts · joined Feb 2005 ·

#599240
Hi Ian,
In this case looser is better ;-) I would agree with .006"
I'd recheck them making sure that the order you turn the engine and adjust each valve is spot on.
To risk stating the obvious again possibly, you should feel slight drag (not binding) with the feeler guage when the gap is right. Also check it again after you tighten the adjusting nut.
You may have a reground cam in which case the valves might just be a bit noisier than on a new cam due to the adjusters acting on the valve tips at a different angle. Or the adjusters might be worn as Dave suggested.
Hope this helps.
Toby :thumb

[ Edited on 27-6-2007 by type3lover ]
.

vw54 Administrator Always Waiting 4 Friday

16,723 posts · joined Aug 2002 ·

#599288
Yes do them in order makes a difference with the engine being rotataed in the correct direction takes all the slack out

also thought of another cause

remove the rocker arm assemblies and pull apart and check the rocker arm shafts for wear .... if these are worn it wont matter how many times you adjust they will always be out of wack
I read it on FACEBOOK so it must be true


http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=91278&page=1#pid848630


http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=63561&page=1#pid624099


http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=4832&page=1#pid452603


http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=60650&page=1#pid574409

Ian Bugden AKA - Bugs

248 posts · joined May 2003 ·

#599366
Hi,
OK, I know that I hand No.1 on tdc, and yes i did rotate the engine backwards and start at 1 then2,3,and then 4. I will re chack them again and re adjust on the weekend as it is too bloody cold to do them after work.

Thanks

Will let you know on progress.

Ian
A good friend will come and bail you out of jail.....
But a true friend will be sitting next to you saying "Damm that was fun!!!"

type3lover in the garage...

796 posts · joined Feb 2005 ·

#599404
Ian Bugden wrote:OK, I know that I hand No.1 on tdc
On the compression stroke? The cam rotates one revolution to every two of the crankshaft.
To check: get engine to No.1 TDC and remove the distributor cap. The rotor must be pointing to where the plug lead to No.1 is. If not it's 180 degrees out.

You're right about it being too bloody cold to work on the car after work!!
Cheers, T
.

Ian Bugden AKA - Bugs

248 posts · joined May 2003 ·

#600030
Yeah, definatly on No. 1 tdc rotor cap pointing at the mark, and no3 on the rocker. Found3 valves that were a little loose so adjusted them and the engine is quieter, but still one the louder side of normal, I am thinking of adjustiong them to 5 thou. I have a aneaking suspision that the 36hp is meant to be at 4 thou but I will play it safe and go 5 thou.

Ian.
A good friend will come and bail you out of jail.....
But a true friend will be sitting next to you saying "Damm that was fun!!!"

vw54 Administrator Always Waiting 4 Friday

16,723 posts · joined Aug 2002 ·

#600033
did u pull the rocker assys and check the wear in the arms and shafts

did you re face the tappet screws ???

leave them at 0.006 and you wont have any problems

Volkswagen put out a service bulletin in about 1972 or so stating that all tappet clearence adjustements on Air cooled engines be revised from 0.004 to 0.006"

Lots of manual stated 0.004 but this is incorrect
I read it on FACEBOOK so it must be true


http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=91278&page=1#pid848630


http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=63561&page=1#pid624099


http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=4832&page=1#pid452603


http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=60650&page=1#pid574409

dangerous 23 Windows of Awesome

5,901 posts · joined Jan 2005 ·

#600037
Often the tip of the valve also gets a little dished
and so even though a .004 feeler will fit nice it may easily be twice that.
Use a dialindicator to see if that is the case.
Will most likely need the tips machined or new valves eventually.
6 or 4 will be fine, as long as it is real.

36ers all have short studs I think.
The ones you are thinking of are the early 40 horse deals that had .008" I think.

I once had a rattly tappet and kept going tighter till it burnt the valve.
On dis-assembly I found thet 'tappet' noise was infact a loose bush in the conrod
where the gugeon pin runs.
westi wrote:That's mad Alan.

vw54 Administrator Always Waiting 4 Friday

16,723 posts · joined Aug 2002 ·

#600042
I once had a rattly tappet and kept going tighter till it burnt the valve. On dis-assembly I found thet 'tappet' noise was infact a loose bush in the conrod where the gugeon pin runs.
Thats a funny one Davo did u use the old screw driver to the ear test procedure works all the time full plastic or wodden handles the prefered test instrument


yeah very important the tappet to valve face always creates a problem especially on high milage engines that havent been looked after
I read it on FACEBOOK so it must be true


http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=91278&page=1#pid848630


http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=63561&page=1#pid624099


http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=4832&page=1#pid452603


http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=60650&page=1#pid574409

Ian Bugden AKA - Bugs

248 posts · joined May 2003 ·

#600264
Yeah it seems odd that the slightedt tweak in valve adj has made them noisy. I will pull the rocker arms and grind the faces. Do I grind them flat or rounded??? The engine was out for the first time about 7 years ago and had a top end rebuild useing good 2nd hand parts and has been very well looked after in the 8 years I have owned the car. I wouldn't think the ends of the valves to be that concave so am assuming it to be the rocker.

Ian.
A good friend will come and bail you out of jail.....
But a true friend will be sitting next to you saying "Damm that was fun!!!"

vw54 Administrator Always Waiting 4 Friday

16,723 posts · joined Aug 2002 ·

#600374
the tips of the tappet screw should be rounded
I read it on FACEBOOK so it must be true


http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=91278&page=1#pid848630


http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=63561&page=1#pid624099


http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=4832&page=1#pid452603


http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=60650&page=1#pid574409

oval TOFU Bitte, ein Bit!

2,946 posts · joined Jul 2003 ·

#600454
dam, i did my 40HP to .004" coz i thought they were too wide. Sounds like it'll have to put em to .006 then... gaaah

Dave, I've still gotta check the type of studs I got! Yes, i'm a slack cint.
...and Robert's ya father's brother...

vw54 Administrator Always Waiting 4 Friday

16,723 posts · joined Aug 2002 ·

#600519
Chris i thought u would have dont that ages ago
I read it on FACEBOOK so it must be true


http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=91278&page=1#pid848630


http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=63561&page=1#pid624099


http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=4832&page=1#pid452603


http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=60650&page=1#pid574409

oval TOFU Bitte, ein Bit!

2,946 posts · joined Jul 2003 ·

#601270
It keeps on slipping my mind. I've adjusted my tappets 4 times, but i havn't had a good look at my studs yet. Mark tells me it could be a noisy valve guide too - which makes sense as the noise occurs when the engine is warm and at constant throttle...
...and Robert's ya father's brother...