Ok.. firstly I don't know much about mechanics so really need some help here.. sorry if this is long but I don't want to miss out anything important...
I've had my 1960 beetle for about 5 years now and never had any problems with shifting (and no major work done on transmission) until this year when I noticed the clutch was slipping quite a bit, stupidly I neglected it because my car is my only daily driver and lots of other things were going on like work and uni commitments. Well this resulted in my clutch breaking and me forced to get it towed to a mechanic near the university. They charged me $522 to replace clutch. It seemed ok clutch/shifting wise but I was unhappy with how they treated my car (oil left all over it- part of the engine tin was only held by one bolt with the others being stripped or missing). I noticed then that it started making this small clicking noise.. this noise progressed to a very loud metallic noise. By now I'd only done about 1000 miles since the clutch job - I took it to another mechanic recommended to me. He informed me that the problem was an incorrect fitted and sized flywheel hitting the starter motor..many of the teeth on the flywheel are damaged, starter motor was damaged and the flywheel was also badly scorched and it appears that the holes around the centre have been drilled wider to get it to fit-
http://i22.tinypic.com/205qp74.jpg
Along with this the wrong sized main seal was also fitted which resulted in a large oil leak. This seal, starter motor and flywheel were replaced (and no issues now).
Upon contacting the other mechanic that did the clutch job they have said take no responsibility for the flywheel or any of the damage saying that they did not touch the flywheel. I find this difficult to believe as it appears new to me and surely I would have had clutch problems previously driving the car over 5 years? Also should they not check the flywheel when replacing the clutch? They have offered me some refund of money 'as goodwill' which to me points some sign of guilt! Unfortunately I just don't know enough about mechanics to argue this so I'd be very grateful for some opinions! Thanks
Heidi - 1960 White Beetle
'65 Kiwi Ghia
If they'd done a proper job the flywheel would've come off to be machined.
It also has to be removed to replace the rear main seal.
HMMM
well that flywheel is drilled for 8 dowls was there 8 in it?
i don't think they should have taken it off but if there was a new rear main seal wrong size then they must have taken it off
sound like the first job was done by a non vw mechanic
and if it has been drilled out you would have had probs long ago
id tell ya what id do with the flywheel and who ever done the job but it's not nice to say out lound !
BUY A REAL BUG A PRE S BUG...
well what can you say we all been there at some time a non vw mugchanic doing what they do so well sounds like you were bent over a barrel and had a repo job done
👍👍😂🙅🥷😬🤓
Sorry to say but apart from leaving your car messy which is not good but not a big thing either it is hard to know what has really been done in regards to the clutch and flywheel so lets not all jump to conclusions here as in regards to the 8 holes , the flywheel may have been in the past previosly removed and redrilled due to the dowells being loose in the original holes , and the new problem may be totally unrelated but just happened to bugger up soon after the recent fix it is hard to tell from a computer 2 states away, and lastly was the engine tin all good before the fix , as a lot of people think there car is all great till some other poor sod has to pull it apart to find a thousand nasties.
Sorry to sound so negetive BUt its how it is sometimes.
Andrew
Don't let body work get in the way of real suspension travel
That is a 36 hp FW and they only have one size.
So I doubt that the wrong FW has been fitted.
Yes it appears to have been drilled for 4 extra dowels,
probably from a previous problem in its life, or an upgrade by someone.
It is common for the FW teeth to be damaged on 6v ring gears,
especially if the starter is run on 12 volts, and/or if the starter bush is worn.
If you have a 12 V starter it will chew up a 6V ringear pretty fast if it engages at all.(different cogs)
There is an argument that the first mechanic SHOULD have had the FW surfaced,
but perhaps to keep with in his original quote,
he chose not to remove it, in case it opened a 'can of worms',
as HAS happened with the extra costs of parts and labour,
and the sight of those extra dowels may have hidden a nasty butcher job under the FW.
Sometimes a mechanic trying to do the job as cheap as possible,
(at the request of a customer, OR to compete with other quotes),
will have the job bite him on the bum at a later time.
westi wrote:That's mad Alan.
That is not a new flywheel,
why would a mechanic replace a fly-wheel then not charge for it ?
Your car your problem , he did what u asked 4 he fixed the clutch.
What do you actualy want to happen ??
Did you take it back to mob one to fix before going elsewhere-I don't blame you if you didn't from the sound of it.
If the first mob has offered to recompense you for your trouble why not accept it gracefully say good result and move on--or are you so cranky (maybe understandably) that you want to rev them mighty ?
If you genuinely think that the first mob who fixed your car caused damage which subsequently cost you money to rectify send them an itemised bill based on what the further costs actualy were (make sure you have receipts for everything) if they wont pay or come to an arrangement with you regarding payment (which it sounds like they will) take the damned thing to small claims--it will take forever if it's anything like QLD but you will eventualy get a result , in QLD you will likely be dead by the time they get there.😬
--but then again thats general for most things in QLD.
Be sure that you file in the right jurisdiction--a warranty claim is likely to be The Small Claims Tribunal and a misrepresentation claim is likely to be The Dept of Fair Trading- gawd help you if you have to go to fair trading they are the most shiftless bunch of monkeys bums you are likely to find--and thats giving monkeys asses a bad rap , don't confuse the two --this is in Queensland it may be different in Vic.
If you have money go see a solicitor , make sure he/she knows commercial and warranty law , not many of them do in anything but the broadest sense so be carefull who you pick.
BEST OF LUCK 😬
Dangerous is on the money!
I think # 2 mechanic is more at fault by "blaming" # 1 , for work # 1 didn't do, and I would say even lying about wrong size seals!!!!
Typical , poor # 1 offers some refund to keep the peace and now that's "admitting fault".
I will say missing bolts and dirty car aren't signs of quality work, but nor is the finger pointing.
Matt Berry Motorsports...air cooled advice, repairs and mods Ph 0408 704 662
OFF-ROAD,CIRCUIT,DRAG,STREET,ENDURANCE
The car is completely 6 volt still... I did send the place who did the clutch repair photos and details on report/invoice #2 mechanic gave. I was never given or expected the work to be done to a quoted price - and to tell the truth expected a good job since the place is both RACV recommended (and apparently warrantied for 125,000km and a VACC member). I did notice that they listed my car as a 1966 on the invoice (which was mailed to me due to computer issues) though not sure if that would affect things such as wrong sized parts?
Thanks a lot for the opinions...from what it sounds I'll just accept their offer of refunding some of the labour costs though I will follow up with both RACV and VACC now that I've done the first step of talking with #1 mechanic.
Heidi - 1960 White Beetle
'65 Kiwi Ghia
did you notice any more difficulty with Heidi starting? any grinding noises with the starter after the clutch replacement? If not i would have to guess that the flywheel has been a long term issue. For the fluywheel and starter to gain that much dmage that quickly you certainly would have noticed some noise and difficulty engaging. If you have had her for 5 years and not touched the clutch in that time, and dont know how long before then it was last replaced, then the problem could be a very old one which has caused slow and gradual damage, maybe the flywheel wasnt clearanced properly, or a tiny fraction off whenever it was redrilled, or it has moved slightly in the 5 or 10 years since it was last touched. If the mechanic you mention did replace the main seal maybe he didnt refit the flywheel tight enough in which case he may have caused the scorching.
Reimagined/Recycled/Upcycled Cool
$522 seems a bit steep to just replace a clutch.If as they said they did not take off the flywheel.Sounds as if flywheel problems were from earlier play by someone.
Accept the money as goodwill and maybe learn to do your own mechanics. At least when you cock up you know who to blame and also who to trust. Almost everytime I've ever taken a VW to someone else to fix-which hasn't been very often!- it's been returned worse than it was at the beginning, even to VW specialists. I'm in my 50s and have had VWs since I was 16 and from day one I started pulling them apart to find out how they worked, much to my dads' distress. I never always got them to work properly but I've many more successes than failures. At least you may have learned who not to take your car to now.
There was some difficulty starting her up.. but I didn't notice a grinding noise more the ticking/clicking noise as it was hitting the starter motor whilst driving.
Heh I didn't want to take the car to them from the beginning but it was just a case of having no other options! I'll probably upgrade my RACV so I can afford to get it towed wherever should I need it. I do hope to learn some things on keeping her maintained (though I can't imagine me being able to install a clutch myself!) but at the moment there just isn't the time with uni and work .. I'm nearly finished uni now though so I can get stuck into my Muir book 🙂
Heidi - 1960 White Beetle
'65 Kiwi Ghia
nah, a clutch is relatively easy, surely Janet has donw one of wolf before? you may have to convince your bf and a mate of his to give you a hand if you ever try to do it (hardest bit is getting the heavy little engine out, i have done it without a hoist but catching the engine once it had left the bellhousing didnt do my arms any favours).
Reimagined/Recycled/Upcycled Cool
I apologise but I didn't realise you were a girl so I can understand you not wanting to do it yourself but as you've a bf just get out the Muir book, get some tools together and just pretend to want to get started and if your bf is worth his salt he'll offer to help then just let him get on with it while you sit back and make encouraging noises😂
ancientbugger wrote:I apologise but I didn't realise you were a girl so I can understand you not wanting to do it yourself but as you've a bf just get out the Muir book, get some tools together and just pretend to want to get started and if your bf is worth his salt he'll offer to help then just let him get on with it while you sit back and make encouraging noises😂
Heh I like the sound of that
😀Heidi - 1960 White Beetle
'65 Kiwi Ghia
"the problem was an incorrect fitted and sized flywheel hitting the starter motor."
With the "difficulty starting her up", did it seem to catch (even slightly) every revolution as you tried to start it?
It sounds to me like maybe the modified flywheel was re-fitted without ensuring it was in EXACTLY the same position that it was in originally dowel/bolt wise when it came off. Maybe he used the 'wrong' set of holes when re-fitting. Really, this would not be mechanic 1's fault.
If it was even slightly off centre compared to how it was 'originally' fitted because of the hole mods, it wouldn't take long to cause damage to the crank seal, and perhaps start to flex enough to touch the ring gear on the starter when running.
A POSSE AD ESSE.
I live in my own little world, but it's okay, they know me here.
