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Att. Hellbus! Strut conversion

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alien8 Wolfsburg Wizard

521 posts · joined Sep 2008 ·

#675877
I was reading a two year old thread last night about a strut conversion you did on a 71 super. The conversion was the 'old school' lowering of the spring cups and re-welding them back on. I think it went 60mm lower with the cup mounts. I like to hear if any problems arose with this and if you thought it could be lowered by ,say, 10 or 15mm more? Stock 15'' rims, 145's -165's ??????????

Anyone else's experiences with this type of thing would be appreciated too.

Cheers!

Joel Now containing 100\% E-Wang

9,368 posts · joined Feb 2006 ·

#675881
i lowered this way many moons ago
i went down 70mm but wouldnt recomend this low
50-60mm max cos the stock inserts run out of travel

10-15mm could be done no probs but would it even be worth it?
the fuel tank from half to full can make that much difference
also i had 185/65 15s back then to no rubbing

alien8 Wolfsburg Wizard

521 posts · joined Sep 2008 ·

#675892
Thanks Joel.

I meant 10-15mm lower than 60mm, being 70mm- 75mm.
But you answered that. If shorter strut inserts were used could you safely go down a total of 75mm from stock? or would you run into geometry problems or guard rubbing? using stock 15'' rims and 165's.

alien8 Wolfsburg Wizard

521 posts · joined Sep 2008 ·

#675894
Cheers Helbus,

60mm it is. I was inspired by your "cheap" conversion and want to get the super's front end down a bit with out blowing a grand on new struts.
Let the grinding begin!

barls Administrator Causer of Chaos and Mayhem

9,473 posts · joined Jun 2004 ·

#675903
one thing to watch is that after 40mm it puts the balljoint bolt really close to the rim and may cause problems
“We all pay for life with death, so everything in between should be free.” Bill Hicks
the chaos project - click me

Joel Now containing 100\% E-Wang

9,368 posts · joined Feb 2006 ·

#675967
alien8 wrote:Thanks Joel.

I meant 10-15mm lower than 60mm, being 70mm- 75mm.
But you answered that. If shorter strut inserts were used could you safely go down a total of 75mm from stock? or would you run into geometry problems or guard rubbing? using stock 15'' rims and 165's.
that was my plan
i got some mk1 golf inserts which are 4" shorter and was gonna cut down the strut housings
but u gotta pick the right brand off inserts
the cofap ones i got had a buldge at the bottom which meant they didnt seat in 3bolt struts

but in the end i ended up going with adjustable struts so height can easily be set not stuck at whatever height perches were welded at

over 2.5" drop tho u really need a bumpstop flip it kit to sort the tierods out

Brad Wolfsburg Elder

3,764 posts · joined Aug 2002 ·

#677403
If you are only running stock wheels this is an easier method just make sure the strut inserts don't bottom.

You can get fully adjustable struts with new inserts, coils etc for $750 the pair and they have 80mm coils so clearance on the tyre is less of an issue if you decide to run wider wheels. The other advantage of adjustable struts is spring rate and the fact you can change the height it if need be. Oh and most Superbug fronts have dead inserts and need replacing anyway.

MAke sure you post some pics if you do the stock struts modified, a few people have looked but I haven't seen anyonepost pics.
Brad
Why copy when you can own an original ?
Meyers Manx Australia

Joel Now containing 100\% E-Wang

9,368 posts · joined Feb 2006 ·

#677443
here ya go Brad
these are mine with cups lowered 70mm - too much
i also cut my bump stops in half and ditched the stock dust sleave

and stock, lowered and adjustbles

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Brad Wolfsburg Elder

3,764 posts · joined Aug 2002 ·

#677444
did u ever end up getting struts to suit ?
Brad
Why copy when you can own an original ?
Meyers Manx Australia

Joel Now containing 100\% E-Wang

9,368 posts · joined Feb 2006 ·

#677451
yeah i bought some mk1 golf ones and was gonna cut the strut housings down to suit

but i shoulda got Konis not cofaps - common logic should have prevailed there but oh well, lesson learned
the cofaps were to thick at the base so they didnt fit in where the superbug strut housings taper at the bottom
konis are slightly smaller in diameter so would have worked fine

the golf cofaps are 4" shorter than my KYB bug inserts

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alien8 Wolfsburg Wizard

521 posts · joined Sep 2008 ·

#677475
I went 60mm lower with the perches and 60mm at the back. Its sitting much better and the front is a lot stiffer. Refitted with new stock sachs inserts and the old coils. I put in a front end poly kit and new ball joints to. It does not seem to have bump steer problems or travel issues but I don't think I like how it handles. Its a little to stiff and jumpy.

I just got a flip kit off Brad and fitting it now but I think I might go with an adjustable strut setup. Got new tie rod ends and its all going back together tonight. I'll see if I can dig up a before pic for a before and after.

alien8 Wolfsburg Wizard

521 posts · joined Sep 2008 ·

#677484
This is after the 60mm drop
[/img]
[/img]
And the strut. You can see the benefit of the "flip kit" The tie rod looking kinda close to the body!
[/img]

I couldn't fine a 'before' pic but it was your typical nose in the air super.

Brad Wolfsburg Elder

3,764 posts · joined Aug 2002 ·

#677486
alien8 wrote:I went 60mm lower with the perches and 60mm at the back. Its sitting much better and the front is a lot stiffer. Refitted with new stock sachs inserts and the old coils. I put in a front end poly kit and new ball joints to. It does not seem to have bump steer problems or travel issues but I don't think I like how it handles. Its a little to stiff and jumpy.

I just got a flip kit off Brad and fitting it now but I think I might go with an adjustable strut setup. Got new tie rod ends and its all going back together tonight. I'll see if I can dig up a before pic for a before and after.
hmmm I have an obvious question to ask, if you just dropped the bottom spring perch down and still use stock insert and coils why would the ride be any harder than stock ? Spring rate and struts are still stock the front of the bug just sits lower which would give a lower center of gravity but I would have thought it still moved the same as before. Any ideas on why the ride changed so much ?
Brad
Why copy when you can own an original ?
Meyers Manx Australia

alien8 Wolfsburg Wizard

521 posts · joined Sep 2008 ·

#677503
Buggy Brad wrote:
alien8 wrote:I went 60mm lower with the perches and 60mm at the back. Its sitting much better and the front is a lot stiffer. Refitted with new stock sachs inserts and the old coils. I put in a front end poly kit and new ball joints to. It does not seem to have bump steer problems or travel issues but I don't think I like how it handles. Its a little to stiff and jumpy.

I just got a flip kit off Brad and fitting it now but I think I might go with an adjustable strut setup. Got new tie rod ends and its all going back together tonight. I'll see if I can dig up a before pic for a before and after.
hmmm I have an obvious question to ask, if you just dropped the bottom spring perch down and still use stock insert and coils why would the ride be any harder than stock ? Spring rate and struts are still stock the front of the bug just sits lower which would give a lower center of gravity but I would have thought it still moved the same as before. Any ideas on why the ride changed so much ?
I think because the stock inserts were flogged out so much.The struts were just all coil. I got used to bouncing down the road. I think its got something to do with using new inserts with the old coils .I am guessing that there is to much insert resistance against the old coils giving a harsher ride over bumps. Does that make sense? I am definitely no expert, more of a weekend hack. If anyone can explain, I am all ears.

1303Steve Scirocco Rare

8,650 posts · joined Aug 2002 ·

#677507
Hi

Ages ago when I used struts with the lowered perches moved I used Mk1 Golf bump stops, they could be trimmed down heaps and the bug plastic sleeve could still be fitted.

Steve