HELP FIRE!!!!!!

Blue65 Officially Full-On Dubber

298 posts · joined Sep 2002 · 2 Aug 2003, 2:54 am

#70407

Oh my god, my beetle caught fire today.

(Before you say anything - I had my beetle regularly serviced at a reputable VW workshop. And the mechanic there had recently put in a "new" 1641cc engine and transmission costing $5000+.)

I noticed a strong smell of petrol after I drove off from the diner restaurant. I pulled over to a bus stop but before I got there - the car started stalling - then BANG. I looked in horror as the engine bay erupted in flames. I ran outside fearing the worse. Flames were pouring out of the engine bay and off the road where petrol had leaked - it was like that movie scene from "Back to the Future".

I rushed back into my Beetle and dragged out my old small fire extinguisher - placed under the rear seat because I would never have to use it - right? (Bugger!) It was night and I couldn't see anything. It took me a few seconds - which seemed like an eternity - to find the safety pin. I sprayed the flames licking from under the engine - then I opened the engine bay - very BAD move - flames shot out straight at me - I somehow managed to avoid getting incinerated. The engine lid slammed back and somehow the fire got put out. The fire engine came 10 minutes later - but there was nothing for them to do.

I called up RACV, and towed it to the mechanics place which was over 25 kms away. The truckie kept on pulling my leg by saying its gonna cost you a f@@@ing fortune mate. In the end it was only $78 - thank God. I've got fire&theft from Shannons Insurance and hopefully that will cover it. Plus, the engine is still under warrenty.

So please - everyone - carry a (chemical)fire extinguisher in your car.

______________________
Owner of a 1964 VW Beetle, 1641cc engine, etc..

56astro Custom Title Time!

1,772 posts · joined Aug 2002 · 2 Aug 2003, 5:59 pm

#70472

Very very lucky there.

Once that magnesium alloy catches alight there ain't no putting it out!

When you find out what caused it let us know will ya. (maybe a fuel line wasn't connected properly)

VW car, VW engine ...... keepin it "real"
35MPG on 101.3kPa

Blue65 Officially Full-On Dubber

298 posts · joined Sep 2002 · 2 Aug 2003, 8:30 pm

#70483

Yeah, I went to see my mechanic today but the dude now takes the first Saturday off. Fortunately, I managed to get hold of his home number and he sent Boris to open up the shop and put it inside for the weekend.

It actually doesn't look so bad in the daylight. The electronic ignition seems slightly burnt but altogether undamaged.

The paint at the edge of the engine lid has bubbled. The left top side of the lid shows a burnt mark. It must have been very hot. Even the fuel hose line is intact. All the fuel clamps are in place.

There is no leaking petrol even though the tank is still half full.

Boris said its looks alright - all thing considering.

______________________
Owner of a 1964 VW Beetle, 1641cc engine, etc..

Purple Martin Fahrvergnugen

913 posts · joined Feb 2003 · 3 Aug 2003, 4:29 pm

#70586

Odd. You noticed a strong smell of petrol just before the fire, yet you say the fuel lines are intact and ther's no petrol leaking. Maybe a line has a split that's not visible, and the petrol only gets squirted through the split when the fuel pump is pumping. Whatever the cause of the fire turns out to be, it sounds like a good opportunity to replace the all fuel lines anyway!

1959 red & white Beetle
1975 Kombi camper

duncombemu Seriously Crusin Dubber

199 posts · joined Jan 2003 · 3 Aug 2003, 6:08 pm

#70600

Like 56astro said, please let us know exactly what the cause was, so we can all check, breath easy and relax.
Regards,
Mark

Don't ever let anyone tell you, "It can't be done."

Blue65 Officially Full-On Dubber

298 posts · joined Sep 2002 · 3 Aug 2003, 9:12 pm

#70649

duncombemu wrote:Like 56astro said, please let us know exactly what the cause was, so we can all check, breath easy and relax.
Regards,
Mark

Ya, I'm going to drive down to Thomastown in 9 hours time (6am). Then I'm going to wait for John and gang to show up (at 8) and find out what the heck went wrong.

(Yesterday, we looked at the fuel lines but they all seemed intact. Maybe the fuel line behind the metal shroud was damaged?)

Anyhow, I'll let you people know tomorrow.

I just hope that all the mechanic will do the right thing and pay for ALL my repair expenses.

I'm feeling simply depressed. This is the 5th time that I had to tow the Beetle to my mechanic shop in Thomastown. I had to tow it back three times (or more) since I put in the new engine/transmission that cost me over $5,000.

And now the Beetle is seriously trying to kill me.

I am really at the end of my rope.

______________________
Owner of a 1964 VW Beetle, 1641cc engine, etc..

Oasis Going alone...

1,806 posts · joined Jul 2003 · 3 Aug 2003, 11:43 pm

#70680

My car recently had a seeping gasket from one of the carbies. The car stunk of petrol and it was very hard to see the leak. Hope that may help.

Don't give up!!! When you get it fixed by your mechanic, take it to another GOOD mechanic to check over. It will cost a little but it'll make you feel better knowing that everything is intact.

"Tell him 'We've already got one'"

Blue65 Officially Full-On Dubber

298 posts · joined Sep 2002 · 4 Aug 2003, 12:32 am

#70682

I probably said it before - but the smell of petrol came only during that fateful drive.

It was not an ongoing problem.

Going to sleep now... zzzzzzzzz:alien

______________________
Owner of a 1964 VW Beetle, 1641cc engine, etc..

Blue65 Officially Full-On Dubber

298 posts · joined Sep 2002 · 4 Aug 2003, 9:53 am

#70715

Aw, what the heck? The mechanic took a good look at the engine with me and all the fuel lines are intact. The main one leading to the carbie is even untouched.

The one on the left side is scorched badly though.

But there is no petrol dripping anywhere.
The fuel tank is still 60% full.

Later in the afternoon, he'll look under it and examine it from there.

I called up Shannons and they are going to send an assessor out to check it out.

______________________
Owner of a 1964 VW Beetle, 1641cc engine, etc..

Blue65 Officially Full-On Dubber

298 posts · joined Sep 2002 · 5 Aug 2003, 9:44 am

#70941

----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Spiliotopoulos" <REMOVEbspili@vlsi.ee.upatras.gr>
Newsgroups: rec.autos.makers.vw.aircooled
Sent: Tuesday, August 05, 2003 12:38 AM
Subject: Re: Oh my god, my Beetle caught fire tonight.

> Because you said that fuel was burning on the road, it means that you had a
> massive fuel leak. Since you said that the fuel tank is still 60% full, it
> means that fuel is dripping only when the engine is running. The main
> suspect is the line from the fuel pump to the carb, where fuel is under
> pressure. Allthough you said that it may seems intact, the brass fitting on
> the carb may have come loose and fuel leaks from there. Try to pull the fuel
> line from the carb to see if it comes out with the brass fitting. The
> fitting to the end of the pump is a suspect too. It is very common for these
> fittings to come loose -- especially if you have a filter between the pump
> and carb -- due to vibration of the hose (bad place to place a filter, place
> it next to the tranny).
>
> Other common thing that causes fires on bugs (but not what happened in your
> case) is the wire going to the heating element of the carb. This wire
> usually falls behind the carb and rubs against the fan housing and the seam
> of the carb's body casting. Eventually it will wear and cause a
> sort-circuit, just next to the carb. To prevent this, you have to smooth the
> casting seam in the front side of the carb, and protect the wire by rolling
> it with electric tape.
>
> Bill,
> '67 bug.
>
>
> "Jerome Morrow" <REMOVETHIS_jerome_morrow@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:YghXa.8204$bo1.2106@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
> > Aw, what the heck? The mechanic took a good look at the engine with me and
> > all the fuel lines are intact. The main one leading to the carbie is even
> > untouched.
> >
> > The one on the left side is scorched badly.
> >
> > But there is no petrol dripping anywhere. The fuel tank is still 60% full.
> >
> > Later in the afternoon, he'll look under it and examine it from there.
> >
> >
>

______________________
Owner of a 1964 VW Beetle, 1641cc engine, etc..

Blue65 Officially Full-On Dubber

298 posts · joined Sep 2002 · 7 Aug 2003, 12:40 pm

#71447

My mechanic thinks hes found the problem. The pin in the 30 year old fuel pump came loose. That would explain why the fuel was sprayed so vigourously all over the back and onto the road.

The car kept on going because of the fuel in the carberator. But once the fuel ran out - it would have backfired and caused the fuel to ignite.

It also explains why the bottom of the engine was so badly burnt.

My mechanic had the same problem with his Beetle 10 years ago. Except that he managed to stop in time.:alien

______________________
Owner of a 1964 VW Beetle, 1641cc engine, etc..

Robo Compulsive Aussie Vee Dubber

4,491 posts · joined Feb 2003 · 10 Aug 2003, 2:53 pm

#72311

glad to see you may have found the cause of the problem, so who is going to take responsibility for the damage?
Rob......

Boxer Power
Member of DMLRK.....Die Mittler Lebuns Resto Komeradschaft

242 Seriously Crusin Dubber

179 posts · joined Sep 2002 · 10 Aug 2003, 6:25 pm

#72359

Good insurance against this problem is to wire all fuel lines onto the fuel pump body/carby. Clamp the hoses with hose clamps at each junction and use enginers wire to secure the lines positvely to the bodys.
Hope all works out for u Blue 65.

Blue65 Officially Full-On Dubber

298 posts · joined Sep 2002 · 11 Aug 2003, 12:07 am

#72483

Hello there,

The insurance assessor came and according to the mechanic - he seemed OK. And told John to fix it as good as new - so it will get a repaint, a new engine lid, new carbie, wires, new gromits, rubbers etc..

At the moment it seems that the insurance company will pay for all of the repairs - but I can't confirm that until I see it in "writing". Verbal agreements are only worth the paper they are "printed" on.

As for the cause of the damage - John (the mechanic) simply says its one of those things - the pin from the old fuel pump came loose. It can't be prevented it seems.

______________________
Owner of a 1964 VW Beetle, 1641cc engine, etc..

Blue65 Officially Full-On Dubber

298 posts · joined Sep 2002 · 5 Sep 2003, 12:55 pm

#82757

I just got my car back. It took me awhile to get someone to give me a lift to Thomastown.

I had to pay $400 in excess. But the repair bill came to be a whole lot more. Haven't got a quote on the full cost - but they had to rewire the engine, get a recon engine lid and paint it, put new gromits and rubbers for the engine, new fuel pump, new air filter, new hoses, repainted engine, new firewall, etc..

Only thing that bugs me at the moment is that the color of the engine lid should be blue to match the front (but can't complain because the old engine lid was a greenish blue color).

The engine also sounds a bit sore- but I'll drive it around for awhile before passing it back to John.

______________________
Owner of a 1964 VW Beetle, 1641cc engine, etc..

68AutoBug Beetle Restorer - Experience over 138\% - YIKES --

11,654 posts · joined Aug 2002 · 5 Sep 2003, 1:21 pm

#82764

That was bad luck.... You must have a kicked a chinaman... (old saying) to have that much bad luck... I have replaced My old fuel pump with an electric fuel pump under the fuel tank... I have replaced My flexible fuel lines with steel braided fuel line with good hose clamps... VW should have used screw in pipes in the Carbies and fuel pumps... as push in pipes just aren't good enough, when using Fuel in a hot enviroment.... even though not many of them pop out.... over 30+ years...
I'm trying to think of a way to make sure the inlet pipe in the carby doesn't pop out.
I think they are just interference fit....
Lee

- Helping keep Air Cooled VWs on the road - location: SCONE in the Upper Hunter Valley - Northern NSW 320 kms NNW of SYDNEY---

68AutoBug Beetle Restorer - Experience over 138\% - YIKES --

11,654 posts · joined Aug 2002 · 5 Sep 2003, 1:53 pm

#82778

after all You problems Blue65, its great to see that Your Beetle is roadworthy again.....
Bad luck on the $400, good luck with the fire extinguisher....
It is best to have them on hand....
What size fire extinguisher did You have..
The standard size in cars etc is usually .9kg. sodium bicarbonate...
Best of Luck from now on.... Lee

- Helping keep Air Cooled VWs on the road - location: SCONE in the Upper Hunter Valley - Northern NSW 320 kms NNW of SYDNEY---

Blue65 Officially Full-On Dubber

298 posts · joined Sep 2002 · 6 Sep 2003, 3:02 am

#83027

hey there - its one of those things I guess. This year has been a series of unfortunate events. I crashed my mum's Volvo in March ($3,000 damage). And now the Beetle tries to kill me after I spent nearly $10,000 it.

The Fire extinguisher is about the size of a 1.5 litres bottle. Quite handy size!!

______________________
Owner of a 1964 VW Beetle, 1641cc engine, etc..