Quality Electronic ignition

v17l Learner Dubber

11 posts · joined Jul 2009 · 16 Jul 2009, 9:53 pm

#724413

Hi
I have just joined the ranks with a 1970 1500 type 1. The beetle has points and I don't have fond memories from my youth having to keep on setting points and the timing in general.

So my question is there a quality electronic ignition system that I can fit to the beetle. I'm told I don't have the 009 dissy.

What is the general things people have fitted?
thanks
steve

68AutoBug Beetle Restorer - Experience over 138\% - YIKES --

11,654 posts · joined Aug 2002 · 17 Jul 2009, 1:06 am

#724442

v17l wrote:Hi
I have just joined the ranks with a 1970 1500 type 1. The beetle has points and I don't have fond memories from my youth having to keep on setting points and the timing in general.

So my question is there a quality electronic ignition system that I can fit to the beetle. I'm told I don't have the 009 dissy.

What is the general things people have fitted?
thanks
steve

Many people have Petronix or other electronic ignition systems which really do make a difference..
Mick Motors and others sell these kits and distributors that come complete with the electronic ignitions...

otherwise its checking and adjusting the points and timing.

Lee

- Helping keep Air Cooled VWs on the road - location: SCONE in the Upper Hunter Valley - Northern NSW 320 kms NNW of SYDNEY---

Bizarre Moderator The artist formerly known as blue74l

12,785 posts · joined Aug 2002 · 17 Jul 2009, 7:32 am

#724453

I use Scorcher

Bosh parts. Readily available
A complete unit

http://www.performanceignition.com.au/

I havent use the one fron VVDS but i have seen they sell a coil pack
No rotor or cap 👍

Futue te ipsum!!!

Joel Now containing 100\% E-Wang

9,368 posts · joined Feb 2006 · 17 Jul 2009, 4:44 pm

#724547

just steer clear of anything with empi/accufire/hotspark etc lables on them

if its under $100 theres a reason

ive been through to many of them
lashed out and got a pertonix ignitorII and had good luck with this one

HotRodMatt If it\'s old or rare - cut it!

3,616 posts · joined Sep 2002 · 17 Jul 2009, 4:48 pm

#724550

Check out the upcoming VWMA... CBB is having unbeatable sales on Pertronix stuff. Modules, dizzies etc.

v17l Learner Dubber

11 posts · joined Jul 2009 · 17 Jul 2009, 4:59 pm

#724553

Thanks everyone for the quick answers.

I'll have to follow up and learn more about these systems.

May I ask what is "VWMA... CBB" as I haven't come accross this acronym before.

One last newbie question, I have to rebuild my tool kit now I have to start working on the dub, is the dub, metric or SAE or some other system?
thanks
steve

Bizarre Moderator The artist formerly known as blue74l

12,785 posts · joined Aug 2002 · 17 Jul 2009, 5:09 pm

#724557

VWMA - VW Magazine Australia http://www.vwma.net.au/

CBB - Custom Bugs and Busses http://www.cbbvw.com/index2.html

Tools - metric - mainly 10,13,17mm would get you 90% of the suckers

Futue te ipsum!!!

v17l Learner Dubber

11 posts · joined Jul 2009 · 17 Jul 2009, 5:22 pm

#724560

Thanks again for the quick reply. I am amazed at all the information that is out there and the advice given. As a newbie, I have to say it is a very friendly atmosphere to ask and learn.

Will chase up those specials mentioned.

As for tools, have now let the word out to the family for my up and coming birthday. I might try to raid my son's toolbox, that would really be revenge...

cheers
steve

PS Bizarre - gotta say your avatar is down right scary.

annosL Officially Full-On Dubber

378 posts · joined Dec 2008 · 20 Jul 2009, 6:21 pm

#725015

I just recently fitted a new dizzy from Dbb and Pertronix ignition, easy to fit and cured most of my tuning problems as well.

jsheppard64 Officially Full-On Dubber

323 posts · joined Mar 2008 · 23 Jul 2009, 12:01 am

#725490

(if you go for cheap things like me)

I've got High energy ignition came as a kit from Dick smith. its proven to be reliable kit came with aluminium box and cost me $25 a few years back. i don't know if they still sell them. the kit operates on points as a signal pick up but there is virtually no current flowing thru so the mechanical wear is little to none.
[i find that you shouldn't mount it in the engine bay.. as i found out on a rainy day the water gets in. because i still had my points i just bypass the kit and run ignition on the points, went home, next day hook it back up and the kit still works]

there is also programmable high energy ignition from jaycar that lets you map the ignition advance and optional knock sensor. there are 3mapping rpm point (low mid high) but that's pretty much enough unless you've got a hi rev racing engine. cost about $100 but u could probably get something like a pointless kit from your vw shop with that price

high energy ignition makes cold start easier and low rev operation too..
these high energy ignition has current limit

and there's a CDI (capacitor discharge ignition) which stores charges inside a capacitor and release a burst into a coil. altho the kit they stock is for a bike but one of the guy said it should work the same
http://www.jaycar.com.au/productView.asp?ID=KC5466

(if you go for cheap things like me)

v17l Learner Dubber

11 posts · joined Jul 2009 · 23 Jul 2009, 8:13 pm

#725602

Hi jsheppard64
As an Electronic Engineer I had been looking very closely at the kits you have mentioned. The siliconchip CDI systems are designed by John Clarke. John's designs are very well thought out and designed.

I have been leaning to the ignitor hall effect points replacement device, because the points are replaced completely. Even with low current, the points still have problems with the constant rubbing on the drive shaft of the distributor.

I did see on youtube a clip of the 009 dissy being installed with the ignitor hall effect point replacement.

I also note that the CDI design in siliconchip can use hall effect devices as a trigger for the CDI, so maybe down the track I might give John's design a whirl. Johns design also requires a hand control kit so that you can program and set up the CDI kit, this is about $60 extra.
regards
steve

v17l Learner Dubber

11 posts · joined Jul 2009 · 23 Jul 2009, 8:16 pm

#725604

Hi annosL
I am not familiar with the acronym Dbb. Is it a company or website.
regards
steve

jsheppard64 Officially Full-On Dubber

323 posts · joined Mar 2008 · 24 Jul 2009, 1:55 am

#725638

well sorry about that then i didn't know CDI uses hall trigger i thought it would be the same as the multi spark CDI kit a few years back from DSE... i originally wanted this but it was discontinued 🙁

I do like having the kit operate from the points because when the kit dies i can just unplug the kit and run the coil on points.
simple but it takes a minute and get me home. however the best thing is to not have it die in the first place. (mine usually die from water)

Plus i have the habit of just pulling things apart so the points are regularly adjusted

v17l Learner Dubber

11 posts · joined Jul 2009 · 24 Jul 2009, 6:35 am

#725642

Hi jsheppard64
I think I should have explained more. The new kt has multiple triggering options and still includes points. From memory it has points, hall effect, optical and reluctor triggering options.
regards
steve

jsheppard64 Officially Full-On Dubber

323 posts · joined Mar 2008 · 24 Jul 2009, 3:21 pm

#725703

I didn't really had a look at the new CDI kit but it will be quite long lasting with your way. i guess i'm still blinded because of my "low funds decease"... i'll stop embarassing myself now

lauzboy Seriously Crusin Dubber

177 posts · joined Mar 2005 · 30 Sep 2009, 1:40 am

#738117

and there's a CDI (capacitor discharge ignition) which stores charges inside a capacitor and release a burst into a coil. altho the kit they stock is for a bike but one of the guy said it should work the same
http://www.jaycar.com.au/productView.asp?ID=KC5466
[/quote]

is there any reason why a bike CDI unit cant be used on a car? theres plenty of cheap bike CDI units on ebay too

lastly anyone know what the difference is between these from jaycar -
http://www.jaycar.com.au/productView.asp?ID=KC5443&CATID=25&form=CAT&SUBCATID=347
http://www.jaycar.com.au/productView.asp?ID=KC5466&CATID=25&form=CAT&SUBCATID=347

cheers
- Jon

jsheppard64 Officially Full-On Dubber

323 posts · joined Mar 2008 · 27 Oct 2009, 10:36 pm

#743647

lauzboy wrote:and there's a CDI (capacitor discharge ignition) which stores charges inside a capacitor and release a burst into a coil. altho the kit they stock is for a bike but one of the guy said it should work the same
http://www.jaycar.com.au/productView.asp?ID=KC5466

is there any reason why a bike CDI unit cant be used on a car? theres plenty of cheap bike CDI units on ebay too

lastly anyone know what the difference is between these from jaycar -
http://www.jaycar.com.au/productView.asp?ID=KC5443&CATID=25&form=CAT&SUBCATID=347
http://www.jaycar.com.au/productView.asp?ID=KC5466&CATID=25&form=CAT&SUBCATID=347

cheers
- Jon [/quote]

One of it is just the Coil Driver from the look it is to be used in conjunction with programmable electronic ignition.

the other one is a CDI for bike
It uses a trigger coil for pick up.
and it uses a generator coil.
both triggered by magnet on a bike's flywheel. i guess you could use it if you have a magneto ignition
but it's probably not going to be easy using it on cars

i mentioned about this one before but i only saw the
jaycar page which was a bit ambiguous as to adaption to be use on cars

I've read about it just now
http://www.siliconchip.com.au/cms/A_110499/article.html

most CDI that can be used on cars are a bit expensive.

last year i ordered Universal High Energy Ignition kit K3303 from Dick Smith cost me $25
(I had to order it coz they don't stock them anymore)
in any case it is sure to work with our 12v bugs

68AutoBug Beetle Restorer - Experience over 138\% - YIKES --

11,654 posts · joined Aug 2002 · 27 Oct 2009, 10:57 pm

#743653

last year i ordered Universal High Energy Ignition kit K3303 from Dick Smith cost me $25
(I had to order it coz they don't stock them anymore)
in any case it is sure to work with our 12v bugs

Hi
I've used a K3303 for a few years now
engine started first time every time... Excellent..
it was used with points...

I have another kit to be made up for use with the Pertronix electronic points replacement.. Hall effect...

My points K3303 HEI stopped working last week at Maccas carpark engine just died...
after hooking up the condenser to the coil...
engine started straight away...

Heat may have caused the HEI transistor to fail, as I have it mounted to the back of the fan housing...
I used to have it at the top of the engine bay on the LHS at first.. thought I'd hide it...

I have heard thats its best not to put the HEI ignition in the VW engine bay... maybe either inside the car or above the gearbox...

the wire coming from the distributor[points] i placed a round male terminal with a plastic cover over it...
the wire from the HEI had a female round connector with a plastic cover over it.. the wire from Condensor also had a round female connector with a plastic cover..
so, after disconnecting the HEI from the - neg side of the coil
I connected a lead from the condensor ..

only small problem was i didn't have the condenser already screwed to the distributor.. if I had that done it would only mean changing two leads.. coil and distributor..

cheers

LEE

PS: The K3303 HEI were worth around $79 when they were being sold at DSE...
this kit is also being sold in the US very cheaply..
but I don't know who is selling them...

cheers

LEE

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- Helping keep Air Cooled VWs on the road - location: SCONE in the Upper Hunter Valley - Northern NSW 320 kms NNW of SYDNEY---

jamiec Seriously Crusin Dubber

112 posts · joined Apr 2009 · 31 Oct 2009, 6:39 am

#744220

I use one of these http://www.123ignition.com.au/ in my morris mini its been awsome sofar😁 and thinking i will get one for the bug when i get to fixing it up.