From my readings of various posts and the very informative How to keep your VW alive book (great read I might add) I have come to the conclusion that I should ditch the 009 dizzy currently on the daughter's bug and go for a SVDA one. I have noticed that it seems to 'stutter' a little when applying the power at low revs sometimes. Since the 009 only advances according to the revs..it cannot take into account the vacuum requirement of the carby and advance to correct for the 'load' the engine is about to experience. Have I got that correct so far?
To cut a long story short..should I get a vacuum advance dizzy and fit an electronic ignition kit to it...or leave it with stock points?
Any reccomendations for dizzy type and part no's and possible cost will be appreciated.
Fixer upperer of daughter's '69 Bug "Oscar"
Cheers
Gazza
What engine/carb do you have? I bought an SVDA and put it on my 1600SP with a 30PICT carb only to find out that a 30PICT carb doesn't generate enough vacumm for it to work properly. It should work ok on a 1600DP with a 34PICT if that's what you have.
Cheers
Steve
From what is written on the side of the carby " SOLEX H30/31 PICT".
And as far as I can determine without pulling the engine down..it is a 74-5 model 1300 case with 1600 P/Bs and DP heads.
Fixer upperer of daughter's '69 Bug "Oscar"
Cheers
Gazza
Are the spark plugs new? The points? have you tested the vacuum advance for vacuum hold? leads?Carby capabilities? there is a series of things.🤪
personally,I just went with an electronic ignition including new dizzy coil and leads.That just eliminates any guess work.(and with VW's its a process of elimination)
I found that my vacuum was not holding and was leaking air through it.If you suck on the vacuum part of the dizzy you should be able to hold it there with your tongue.I know it sounds sick but it is a constructive test.If you cant hold suck on it ,it may be worn or perished. just depends on what system you want.some new vacuum advance dizzy are pretty good.As are some ignition modules that you can install your self getting rid of points.I think the modules are around $150.(but don't quote me on that).I paid around $380 i think.For new dizzy with module fitted,new high voltage coil and leads.Which i thought wanst too bad.I am very happy with it all.
Im still learning this stuff too.😂
Hope this helps.😊
"A car for the people, an affordable Volkswagen, would bring great joy to the masses and the problems of building such a car must be faced with courage."
Adolf Hitler At opening of 1934 Berlin Auto Show
Gazza 265,
I just recently got a 'copy' SVDA, approx $60 from Classic Vee Dub, replaced my german 009, running a 34pict-3 carb. Now much more driveable, more fun, and I havent re-tuned anything, just checked the points and set the timing with a timing light for max advance 32 deg btdc.
Been doing lotsa fiddling with various dizzies the past month or so and have concluded that electronic points do smooth out the running but are susceptible to failures through either poor quality, incorrect coils, or incorrect connections frying the internals.
I have ordered a mexican bosch SVDA from Hot Spark ignition products in the US for around $210 posted here, and that comes with electronic points installed.
It also seems to me that the australian made bosch distributors will not take the more common electronic points modules, due to slight internal differences.
I believe your H30/31PICT will 'suck' enough for an SVDA, but you should search for info on H30/31 on the US websites as they are a modern replacemnt for many early carbs and designed to cover all functions, and they have threee vacuum ports to pick from..
It seems that in the past if people had to replace a faulty distributor the 009 was cheaper and more readily available and we all convinced ourselves it was a better driving experience....
But now the SVDA is the 'best thing' ...
Thanks for that Uber Kafer, don't get me wrong...the little bugger hurtles at lightspeed when it gets over that intermittent stutter. It runs very smoothly most of the time..but that stutter is something I know I can fix.
I think I will purchase one of the Classic vee Dub ones and see if that smooths it out...if not...then I'll recommend that my daughter shell out for a higher quality one.
Again...the helpful information that is freely given here continues to impress and gladden me...such a friendly clique..this VW mob.
Cheers
Fixer upperer of daughter's '69 Bug "Oscar"
Cheers
Gazza
No worries Gazz-Fixer-Upperer.
I think your daughter will prefer the smoothness and drive-ability with the SVDA, and you will probably get excellent service out of the $60 distributor. The reason I'm getting the Bosch one is that I have 3 beetles and a Karmann Ghia to look after.
Just be aware that your engine 'may' have been previously tuned richer at the bottom end to compensate for the typical 009 flat-spot. So it will drive a lot better but it may still require a liittle un-frigging to get full benefit of the SVDA.
I've yet to optimise mine, as I'm hopeless at carb tuning, my 15 year old son is better than me.
Gazza265 wrote:From my readings of various posts and the very informative How to keep your VW alive book (great read I might add) I have come to the conclusion that I should ditch the 009 dizzy currently on the daughter's bug and go for a SVDA one. I have noticed that it seems to 'stutter' a little when applying the power at low revs sometimes. Since the 009 only advances according to the revs..it cannot take into account the vacuum requirement of the carby and advance to correct for the 'load' the engine is about to experience. Have I got that correct so far?
To cut a long story short..should I get a vacuum advance dizzy and fit an electronic ignition kit to it...or leave it with stock points?
Any reccomendations for dizzy type and part no's and possible cost will be appreciated.
Hi
Yes the SVDA dizzy is the correct one for Our beetles...
as You said correctly that the 009 needs revs to advance...
I don't know of anyone who has had the 009 hesitation...
in Australia...
its VERY common in the USA as they had pollution controls on their carburetors and the 009s don't work as well...
so they adjust the accellerator pump to pump MORE fuel in every time they hit the throttle...
that doesn't need to be done here...
I have My 009 set at 32 degrees... but have been told recently that I shouldn't go past 28 degrees...
I have bought a NEW Bosch dizzy from aircooled.net in the USA
they tune each distributor to the carburetor You are using...
and also sell the Pertronix electron ignition which I also bought but haven't used as yet...
I did have a HIGH Energy electronic ignition using My 009 with points for a few years... and the electronic ignition made heaps of difference.... also the engine started every time I turned the key.... EXCELLENT...
I haven't fitted the New dizzy with pertronix as yet...
so it doesn't start instantly any longer... lol
LEE
PS: others have bought the cheap version of the SVDA with good results... Lee
- Helping keep Air Cooled VWs on the road - location: SCONE in the Upper Hunter Valley - Northern NSW 320 kms NNW of SYDNEY---
Dont know if anyone is interested, but we do alot of this for dissy's where customers cant afford new expensive stuff. Pull the advance weights and springs, couple of tack welds to join the shaft to the advance plate, then set timing to the total degrees the engine wants.
clinker42 wrote:Dont know if anyone is interested, but we do alot of this for dissy's where customers cant afford new expensive stuff. Pull the advance weights and springs, couple of tack welds to join the shaft to the advance plate, then set timing to the total degrees the engine wants.
Your kidding , right?
Matt Berry Motorsports...air cooled advice, repairs and mods Ph 0408 704 662
OFF-ROAD,CIRCUIT,DRAG,STREET,ENDURANCE
Hey 68Autobug,
heres 1 person in Australia who has absolutely experienced the 009 hesitation blues...
and I am fairly certain you could add quite a few zeros behind that number 1 to tally up everybody else who has put up with it.
Gee I must be # 2 through 202 with all the cars with oo9 flat spot I've repaired 😁.
Matt Berry Motorsports...air cooled advice, repairs and mods Ph 0408 704 662
OFF-ROAD,CIRCUIT,DRAG,STREET,ENDURANCE
Hi
its just that I don't know of anyone or heard of anyone in Australia who has the 009 hesitation problem...
all the locals use 009s and always have without any problems.
maybe You have it advanced too far or the idle speed of Your engine is too low...??
I read about the SVDA You bought and decided on the aircooled.net one...
I have read of hundreds of beetle etc owners in the USA & Canada all having the 009 hesitation problems...
cheers
LEE
- Helping keep Air Cooled VWs on the road - location: SCONE in the Upper Hunter Valley - Northern NSW 320 kms NNW of SYDNEY---
matberry wrote:Gee I must be # 2 through 202 with all the cars with oo9 flat spot I've repaired 😁.
then again Mat
thats why aircooled.net bought out the SVDA to fix the 009 problem in the USA & Canada..
they are still trying to get people to stop using the 009 over there..
but their carbies had a dash pot and other pollution stuff on their engines.. from about 1970ish..
I do see that the engine has to rev before it can advance...
interesting to see that the problem is in Australia too...
LEE
PS: see, I don't know everything.. lol
🙅- Helping keep Air Cooled VWs on the road - location: SCONE in the Upper Hunter Valley - Northern NSW 320 kms NNW of SYDNEY---
Some people just seem to put up with things being far from right.
As for knowing everything.....who does?
Matt Berry Motorsports...air cooled advice, repairs and mods Ph 0408 704 662
OFF-ROAD,CIRCUIT,DRAG,STREET,ENDURANCE
clinker42 wrote:Dont know if anyone is interested, but we do alot of this for dissy's where customers cant afford new expensive stuff. Pull the advance weights and springs, couple of tack welds to join the shaft to the advance plate, then set timing to the total degrees the engine wants.
🤪👎
Crack , bang, clatter, clatter!!!!! "honey, get the icecream tub from the back seat... the motor is all over the highway..."
Ditto, hope you are not working on any of our engines...
Even having a worn out distributor is better than "performing " that "mod". I only use new 009's to strip for housings, shafts/bushes/shims to help in restoring original distributors... They are an industrial motor distributor and just a copy of VW 126 905 205 which was the original "009".
The SVDA is just a copy of 043 905 205 which was the first correct 1600 distributor for a 1600 DP beetle engine and 34PICT3 with NO pollution controls. Even these have too much initial centrifugal advance for a 1600 bus at around 2000rpm.
Here is what you should be doing with your original distributor...
Well, I haven't done My autumn work on My beetle as yet
like install the SVDA dizzy [Bosch] and the pertronix ignitor
but My car has been going better each year... lol
I may have been running it a bit too rich at first...
but have changed the spark plugs, leads, points, dizzy cap, rotor and now running a new condensor again...
also done the tappets at every oil change...
now running extractor exhaust...
waiting for the cooler weather.. lol
it will do 120KMH any where.. maybe more.. lol..
but only tried it a few times....
I like to stick to the speed limit... lol
cheers
Lee
- Helping keep Air Cooled VWs on the road - location: SCONE in the Upper Hunter Valley - Northern NSW 320 kms NNW of SYDNEY---
68AutoBug wrote:Well, I haven't done My autumn work on My beetle as yet
like install the SVDA dizzy [Bosch] and the pertronix ignitor
but My car has been going better each year... lol
I may have been running it a bit too rich at first...
but have changed the spark plugs, leads, points, dizzy cap, rotor and now running a new condensor again...
also done the tappets at every oil change...
now running extractor exhaust...
waiting for the cooler weather.. lol
it will do 120KMH any where.. maybe more.. lol..
but only tried it a few times....
I like to stick to the speed limit... lol
cheers
Lee
set your total advance to 32 degrees as an absolute maximum. 28 degrees should be fairly safe. If it pings under load going up a steep hill, back it off a bit, but should not do it when set to 28 degrees.
Also, how is your fuel consumption, tuning rich masks the flat spot somewhat. Get the car on a gas analyser and dial the CO in to 3% which is what it should be, then go for a drive, you WILL feel the flat spot...
my god hes like a wannabe glenn from the samba 😂
1500 and earlier usually run ok with a 009
its the later solexs like 34pict3 and the twins fitted to type3s and kombis that dont agree with 009s
you can frig around with them and get rid of the flat spot, my mates Sbug has a brazillian 34pict3 and a chinese 009 and it hasnt got any flat spot but its cos its fueled up to buggery and it does go like a cat shot in the bum but as a trade off around town mileage sucks
Joel wrote:my god hes like a wannabe glenn from the samba 😂
No wannabe about it.... been doing them for almost 20 years...I don't reinstall used vacuum cans and bushes .... or brush paint the housings.... or accept oil leaks on a motor build, I don't do "fuel trade offs" to get a motor running right, I don't have issues with washed bores from over fuelling, no detonation issues and I get good mileage(funny bout that...) or other dodgey crap for that matter....
BTW, the distributor in the middle of the pic of three distributors is NOT a 36hp distributor...
no offence intended dyno, was just the first thing that popped into my head.
I'm guessing you know of who I'm referring to, distributors seem to be his life so it was like dejavu
Given that the opinion here seems to favour a combined vacuum and mechanical advance dissie over the 009 mechanical advance only, is there any way I could modify a Weber 40DCN to give me a vacuum port to connect to the dissie?
In answer to the original question about electronic kits, my experience with a Compufire electronic kit has been mixed. Once I loctited the module mounting screw it worked great (for many years) however when I needed a replacement chopper wheel Compufire charged me $72 to ship a $13 part from the US!Fantastic not having to stuff around with points though
I installed the mexican bosch SVDA which I got from Hot Spark in the US, and I can report a noticeable improvement in quality over the cheap copies that are being sold. ( ironic that I am promoting mexican VW stuff as the best standard )
My main concern is the installation instructions suggest that with vacuum hose connected and engine running, a total of 40 - 42 deg BTDC is desireable..... !!!!
I have only ever seen a max of 32 deg reccomended.
Any comments ??
Uber Kafer wrote:I installed the mexican bosch SVDA which I got from Hot Spark in the US, and I can report a noticeable improvement in quality over the cheap copies that are being sold. ( ironic that I am promoting mexican VW stuff as the best standard )
My main concern is the installation instructions suggest that with vacuum hose connected and engine running, a total of 40 - 42 deg BTDC is desireable..... !!!!
I have only ever seen a max of 32 deg reccomended.
Any comments ??
That sounds spot on. With the vac disconnected it should be around 30 BTDC and 40 BTDC with the vac connected at full advance
