Hi Guys
I want to get a new coil for the bus 77 2ltr Kombi, what one do I need GT 40R or non resistor! Has any one got one of those new plastic or resin GT 40's are they better than the oil filled can, type? I also want to go with a petronix points eliminator ingnition system.
Any comments appreciated!
Rob.......
[Edited on 27-8-2003 by Robo]
Boxer Power
Member of DMLRK.....Die Mittler Lebuns Resto Komeradschaft
GT40 not R
mixed feelings & opionions about new type they don't actually "work any better" as in you wont notice any difference, they are certainly a lot smaller, which can be an advantage, & lighter
Please, I need drivers side window regulator (winder mechanism) for my '54
Thanks Kim!
I have been thinking of mounting it off the engine, the smaller plastic one's would be better for this I would imagine! also do you have any knowlage of the breaker less points eliminator systems. will they work with a GT 40 coil?
Rob......
Boxer Power
Member of DMLRK.....Die Mittler Lebuns Resto Komeradschaft
BizarreModeratorThe artist formerly known as blue74l
the coil i had was a SU120... i think that is the one blue 74 is talking about. i had a pointless conversion but the two things were never on the engine at the same time....
my answer would be that the GT40 would be compatible with any "any"(most)breakerless bolt on, decide on a breakerless system (I will be getting a magfire) then get the coil, I guess
Please, I need drivers side window regulator (winder mechanism) for my '54
Have used countless numbers of Oil filled Bosch GT40 coils with both the Compufire and Petronix drop in point replacement electronic ignition kits. Both worked faultless. Do prefer the Petronix kit, little neater and fits slighlty better. As for the newer style resin filled transister sytle GT40 wouldn't touch them anymore. Can remember of at least 4 that I have taken of engines and replaced, one at least that I fitted, also know of one very well repected VW enthusist that works for the NRMA that has nothing good to say about the same sytle of coil. Can't go past the old Oil filled Bosch GT40 triggered by the simple and cost affective Petronix electronics.
Each to their own just remember what goes around come around.
Craig Torrens6 times Australian, 7 times State Hillclimb Class Champion
personally I bought one when they first came out & it died, as in weak spark, within a year, & never bought another one
BUT I know people who have fitted them & had no trouble , it may be that initial teething problems have been sorted - because of my bad experience I am loathe to risk geting another one
Please, I need drivers side window regulator (winder mechanism) for my '54
Craig Torrens6 times Australian, 7 times State Hillclimb Class Champion
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Thinking of what could make a difference spark wise between a motor with single carb and that with twin carb's. Nothing springs to mind except the twin carb's were feeding the engine too much fuel wetting down the plugs causing the electrode to become soaked with fuel and resulting in a misfire. Ar just a thought.😉
Each to their own just remember what goes around come around.
FirstName V LastName W wrote:?????????????????????????????????????
Thinking of what could make a difference spark wise between a motor with single carb and that with twin carb's. Nothing springs to mind except the twin carb's were feeding the engine too much fuel wetting down the plugs causing the electrode to become soaked with fuel and resulting in a misfire. Ar just a thought.😉
Your close, not "too much" fuel just more. Twin carbies will show the weakness in a coil as the motor is put under more load, and a weaker spark with make the motor missfire, usually at a higher rev range than a single carbie motor.:thumb
I've been using the same GT40 (red) oil filled coil with a Pertronix ignitor module & twin carbies for about 6 years now.
I might have just got lucky it seems.?
regards
Jak
Congratulations to Ben Durie for breaking the hillclimb record at Ringwood in his stroker beetle!
I think things are getting a little confused with the "red coil" bit.
The classic GT40 "red coil" has been around for 30 years and has been used with great success by many VW owners. The "40" part refers to it's output of 40kV peak in comparison to a stock coil's 20 or so. Sorry, mnsKmobi, but your guy doesn't seem to know much about electrical theory - "the amount of energy going into your coil is determined by the points." I think he's getting confused by the extra energy available with the "dwell extension" provided by most electronic ignitions. The red coil has slightly less turns on the primary and more turns on the secondary. This produces a spark of faster rise time, higher peak voltage and higher energy, but with some loss in the length (time-wise) of the spark. This is great for firing leaner mixtures, fouled plugs or at higher revs.
In more recent times, Bosch have brought out an epoxy-type coil, also red and also called a GT40, which does not have any advatages I can see except it looks a bit trendier. Oil-filled coils have a "self-healing" property (to cope with inevitable spikes through the insulating material, usually a kind of paper,) whereas epoxy does not. This, combined with their inferior ability to dissipate and cope with heat, may be why these latter types have developed a reputation for unreliability. They are also not compatible with many "pointless" ignitions due to their lower primary resistance.
Finally, I don't think anyone answered one of the original questions: A non-resistor type coil should always be used with VWs, they never used a starter resistor.
68AutoBugBeetle Restorer - Experience over 138\% - YIKES --
I believe the "starter resistor" coils such as the GT40R was used in 6 & 8 cylinder cars to help them have enough spark when winding the Larger engines over. There is no reason why a resistor type coil couldn't be used (with a Resistor) on a VW engine. Its just that they never were, and I have never seen one on a VW personally. I have read where the GT40 Bosch coils shouldn't be used with Electronic or CDI Ignition systems. I am installing a DSE High Energy Ignition in My 68 AutoBug and the instructions say NOT to use the "High Output" type coils like the GT40.
CDI = Capacitor Discharge Ignition
DSE = Dick Smith Electronics
68AutoBug wrote:I believe the "starter resistor" coils such as the GT40R was used in 6 & 8 cylinder cars to help them have enough spark when winding the Larger engines over.
The coils used with resistors are designed to run at 6V (or there abouts). They have two connections on the +ve side. One bypasses the resistor and only gets current when you're cranking the engine over. This means that you get a better spark at starting because you're sending > 6V through a 6V coil. But if you keep doing that you'll shag the coil, so once the engine has started, the coil draws current via the resistor to drop the 12-14 volts to 6V. The idea is that a non-resistor coil is going to be putting out less spark at starting because it is designed to run at >12V and is getting < 12V because the starter motor drops the voltage so much.
There is no reason why a resistor type coil couldn't be used (with a Resistor) on a VW engine. Its just that they never were, and I have never seen one on a VW personally.
Seems reasonable, though you wouldn't get the starting advantage without a bit of f#@king around.
68AutoBugBeetle Restorer - Experience over 138\% - YIKES --
Thanks for that info, as I said I haven't had anything to do with the external resistor coils but it would take a bit to use them correctly on a VW.... unless it was just connected via the resistor all the time, whether the engine would start is another question...
I have a couple of these so I'll give them to My Son who is a VW & Ford enthusist.
thanks again.... I love learning.... Lee
- Helping keep Air Cooled VWs on the road - location: SCONE in the Upper Hunter Valley - Northern NSW 320 kms NNW of SYDNEY---
