which bug?

18 posts · joined Jan 2011 · 12 Jan 2011, 9:18 pm

#821302

Hi all,

Just a bit about me & my vehiclular history...I have mostly been into frogs but i did have a golf mk II GTI a few years back 😁

The reason why i registered is that about 10 years ago I saw a gorgeous white bug in a car yard in Dandenong (Melbourne). Cut a long story short, my dad ended up buying it and selling it a few years later. I saw it for a few years more always parked outside Dandy Volks (someone that worked there must have bought it i guess)

All those years later, the bug has bit me! I would love to buy exactly that one...but tracking it down...& wether the owner wants to part with it may be a hard task. But if anyone can help..all i can remember it had the older sloping headlights, white duco, white mag weels & was pretty low. A lot of the chrome was color coded white. The rear lights were the newer ones (not elephant paw) 68-72? So many hours spent on the spotters forum 🥲

Anyway, in order to work out which bug will initially suit as a starting point i have a few questions: earlier guards fit on later standard bugs (as i have researched on the forum) but wont fit any superbugs? also whats the deal with 68-69 models having 1200 engines? Is this a retro fit?

Great site btw its a great resource & happy dubbing

waveman1500 Also rides a Honda

1,346 posts · joined Dec 2009 · 12 Jan 2011, 11:22 pm

#821319

G'day mate. It sounds like your search could be quite a mission.

In Europe they offered Beetles with 1200cc engines all the way through into the mid '70s and the production of the Golf. Over here in Australia there were no more 1200s after 1968, only 1300cc, 1500cc and 1600cc. 1300s were the base model and were still offered until 1975, whilst the 1500cc Beetle was offered from '68 to '71-ish. After that the Super Beetles were available with 1600cc engines.

You are correct that the old-style fenders will fit quite easily onto any model of Beetle except the Superbugs. The early bumpers are easily fitted as well, so unless you had a chassis number or a fair few detailed photos it would be difficult to tell what year it is. The 'late model' style tail-light lenses were only red/amber from '68-'71, then from some time in mid-'71 onwards they gained clear reversing lights at the bottom. Once again though, tail-lights are very easily changed.

One of the easier ways to date a bodyshell is by whether or not it has the little plastic crescent-shaped vent behind the rear side windows. These came in with the Super Beetle around 1971 and I believe that they were also used on the 1300s from then on.

Welcome to the forum and good luck!

1972 VW S-Bug - For Sale!
1968-onwards Beetle panels and glass for sale

68AutoBug Beetle Restorer - Experience over 138\% - YIKES --

11,654 posts · joined Aug 2002 · 13 Jan 2011, 12:52 am

#821324

michelineister wrote:Hi all,

Just a bit about me & my vehiclular history...I have mostly been into frogs but i did have a golf mk II GTI a few years back 😁

The reason why i registered is that about 10 years ago I saw a gorgeous white bug in a car yard in Dandenong (Melbourne). Cut a long story short, my dad ended up buying it and selling it a few years later. I saw it for a few years more always parked outside Dandy Volks (someone that worked there must have bought it i guess)

Hi,
1200 engines finished in Australia in 1967 and most then were 1300..
the last beetle made in Germany was a standard Beetle with a 1200 engine.. in 1978

the 1200 standards were a big seller in Germany...

1200 & 1300 Beetles were also sold in the UK & Europe even in Super Beetle bodies...

The beetle You have described may have been a 1968-70 model... NON Super...
with early front guards and sloping headlamps...
seeing the chrome was painted it was modified somewhat...
and lowered etc...

most beetles in Australia are now 1600 cc or larger...

there are the odd 1500 - 1300 and very few 1200 engines...

cheers

LEE

All those years later, the bug has bit me! I would love to buy exactly that one...but tracking it down...& wether the owner wants to part with it may be a hard task. But if anyone can help..all i can remember it had the older sloping headlights, white duco, white mag weels & was pretty low. A lot of the chrome was color coded white. The rear lights were the newer ones (not elephant paw) 68-72? So many hours spent on the spotters forum 🥲

Anyway, in order to work out which bug will initially suit as a starting point i have a few questions: earlier guards fit on later standard bugs (as i have researched on the forum) but wont fit any superbugs? also whats the deal with 68-69 models having 1200 engines? Is this a retro fit?

Great site btw its a great resource & happy dubbing

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- Helping keep Air Cooled VWs on the road - location: SCONE in the Upper Hunter Valley - Northern NSW 320 kms NNW of SYDNEY---

michelineister Learner Dubber

18 posts · joined Jan 2011 · 14 Jan 2011, 2:39 pm

#821517

waveman1500 wrote:G'day mate. It sounds like your search could be quite a mission.

In Europe they offered Beetles with 1200cc engines all the way through into the mid '70s and the production of the Golf. Over here in Australia there were no more 1200s after 1968, only 1300cc, 1500cc and 1600cc. 1300s were the base model and were still offered until 1975, whilst the 1500cc Beetle was offered from '68 to '71-ish. After that the Super Beetles were available with 1600cc engines.

You are correct that the old-style fenders will fit quite easily onto any model of Beetle except the Superbugs. The early bumpers are easily fitted as well, so unless you had a chassis number or a fair few detailed photos it would be difficult to tell what year it is. The 'late model' style tail-light lenses were only red/amber from '68-'71, then from some time in mid-'71 onwards they gained clear reversing lights at the bottom. Once again though, tail-lights are very easily changed.

One of the easier ways to date a bodyshell is by whether or not it has the little plastic crescent-shaped vent behind the rear side windows. These came in with the Super Beetle around 1971 and I believe that they were also used on the 1300s from then on.

Welcome to the forum and good luck!

Thanks for the replies

Just a couple more newb questions...is the assumption that a '72 semi auto must be a super s correct? would it be possible to change the whole front (forward of door hinges) end of such a bug to accomodate the earlier sloping headlights?

& just to clarify, earlier guards could easily fit say a 74 bug as long as its the 1300 & not a super?

68autobug> a 68 with 71-74 lights?

68AutoBug Beetle Restorer - Experience over 138\% - YIKES --

11,654 posts · joined Aug 2002 · 14 Jan 2011, 3:15 pm

#821525

HI again,

the vertical headlamps appeared in 1968 beetles in AUstralia..
and Yes, any automatic beetle after 1970 would be a Super...

You can buy fibreglass front guards to fit SUPERS with the sloping headlamps...

but as You know the original early guards will just bolt onto a NON Super beetle...

a 1300 from 1968 to 1974 or a 1500 beetle from 1968 to 1970.. were non supers..

IF You read any books on VWs.... You will find many differences between Australian and overseas beetles..

I have seen a 1968 standard beetle that had very little chrome on it , it had been delivered to a Dealer in Sydney from a Ship... that was going to New Zealand...
it was a German made white beetle with sloping headlamps
and the normally chromed parts were all painted white..
and early bumpers etc... I think it was a 1300 engine..

a 1976 beetle was NOT a super...
it was very similar to My 1968 beetle.... same rear suspension
but has the crescent shaped ventilation piece on the side behind the side windows...

Mexican beetles didn't have these bits on the side but had the shape there but it wasn't cut out...

cheers

LEE

- Helping keep Air Cooled VWs on the road - location: SCONE in the Upper Hunter Valley - Northern NSW 320 kms NNW of SYDNEY---

Joel Now containing 100\% E-Wang

9,368 posts · joined Feb 2006 · 14 Jan 2011, 4:30 pm

#821549

michelineister wrote:Just a couple more newb questions...is the assumption that a '72 semi auto must be a super s correct? would it be possible to change the whole front (forward of door hinges) end of such a bug to accomodate the earlier sloping headlights?

& just to clarify, earlier guards could easily fit say a 74 bug as long as its the 1300 & not a super?

there's no easy way to do that and besides it's not worth spending 1000s to make a car look early when you can spend that money and just buy an early car.
You can put early guards on any late standard beelte but without putting an early apron and hood it too they just look stupid.
my 70 bug had early gaurds when i first bought it, the late hood and decklid does not match early gaurds

Just to clear somthing else up 65 was the last year of 1200 engines in Oz, that blue bug your talking about has just had a 40hp 1200 fitted to keep it going it was a 1500 originally.
Not unheard of, all the engines can be swapped, I had a 75 1300 beetle that was fitted with a 61 model stale air 1200.

michelineister Learner Dubber

18 posts · joined Jan 2011 · 14 Jan 2011, 4:44 pm

#821558

68AutoBug wrote:HI again,

the vertical headlamps appeared in 1968 beetles in AUstralia..
and Yes, any automatic beetle after 1970 would be a Super...

You can buy fibreglass front guards to fit SUPERS with the sloping headlamps...

but as You know the original early guards will just bolt onto a NON Super beetle...

a 1300 from 1968 to 1974 or a 1500 beetle from 1968 to 1970.. were non supers..

IF You read any books on VWs.... You will find many differences between Australian and overseas beetles..

I have seen a 1968 standard beetle that had very little chrome on it , it had been delivered to a Dealer in Sydney from a Ship... that was going to New Zealand...
it was a German made white beetle with sloping headlamps
and the normally chromed parts were all painted white..
and early bumpers etc... I think it was a 1300 engine..

a 1976 beetle was NOT a super...
it was very similar to My 1968 beetle.... same rear suspension
but has the crescent shaped ventilation piece on the side behind the side windows...

Mexican beetles didn't have these bits on the side but had the shape there but it wasn't cut out...

cheers

LEE

You can buy WHAAT?? where can i get myself some fibreglass guards?? I googled a search & look what came up...anyone for extra boot ventilation?😂

http://www.fibrefab.com.au/panelsale/2-Scoop-Bonnet-Pre-67.jpg

Thanks for the reply, im starting to get the jist of the models..I'll confuse myself later with the overseas denominations

Interesting to hear about that white bug..definately going for that white color coded look...how does one paint on chrome and make the paint stick? looking in the body forum..

Ive got my sight on a bug thats for sale...I might go for my first bug inspection on the weekend. What are the main things to look for mechanically with air coolers?

Bizarre Moderator The artist formerly known as blue74l

12,789 posts · joined Aug 2002 · 14 Jan 2011, 5:12 pm

#821564

"What are the main things to look for mechanically with air coolers?"

EVERYTHING can be replaced

look for rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust

Oh - and while you are at it

Look for rust 😂😂

Futue te ipsum!!!

Joel Now containing 100\% E-Wang

9,368 posts · joined Feb 2006 · 14 Jan 2011, 5:20 pm

#821566

^^ This.

Re. colour coding chromework, just scuff it up good and etch prime then paint as normal.

Did mine like this years ago holding up fine.

michelineister Learner Dubber

18 posts · joined Jan 2011 · 15 Jan 2011, 5:55 pm

#821710

Bizarre wrote:"What are the main things to look for mechanically with air coolers?"

EVERYTHING can be replaced

look for rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust, rust

Oh - and while you are at it

Look for rust 😂😂

...the guy said the rust was complimentary😂

Joel - I just want the pre 67 look on the front of my bug...If i gotta change more parts than the guards so that it all lines up at the front...so be it. Ive been looking around at bugs & there seems to be a hell of a lot of supers out there atm so if there are pre 67 fibreglass guards that will fit on them it would open up my options

jeremyluke Seriously Crusin Dubber

126 posts · joined Mar 2010 · 15 Jan 2011, 7:57 pm

#821726

Joel wrote:
michelineister wrote:Just a couple more newb questions...is the assumption that a '72 semi auto must be a super s correct? would it be possible to change the whole front (forward of door hinges) end of such a bug to accomodate the earlier sloping headlights?

& just to clarify, earlier guards could easily fit say a 74 bug as long as its the 1300 & not a super?
there's no easy way to do that and besides it's not worth spending 1000s to make a car look early when you can spend that money and just buy an early car.
You can put early guards on any late standard beelte but without putting an early apron and hood it too they just look stupid.
my 70 bug had early gaurds when i first bought it, the late hood and decklid does not match early gaurds

Just to clear somthing else up 65 was the last year of 1200 engines in Oz, that blue bug your talking about has just had a 40hp 1200 fitted to keep it going it was a 1500 originally.
Not unheard of, all the engines can be swapped, I had a 75 1300 beetle that was fitted with a 61 model stale air 1200.

I agree with Joel, putting the sloped headlights and early bumpers on a late beetle would look Dicky, specially on a Super, that would look Horrific with the wide bonnet and scary if it was a L bug with the curved windscreen...

If you want a pre '67 look, buy a bug from pre '67, may cost more but the other way your gonna end up spending even more trying to make it look like an early bug

Look on eBay and Carsales.com (heaps on car sales)

Joel Now containing 100\% E-Wang

9,368 posts · joined Feb 2006 · 15 Jan 2011, 8:05 pm

#821730

jeremyluke wrote:that would look Horrific with the wide bonnet and scary if it was a L bug with the curved windscreen...

Dont poopoo it till you've seen it

Although those are Porsche lights not VW which makes all the differnce

But yes usually they look bloody awefull

jeremyluke Seriously Crusin Dubber

126 posts · joined Mar 2010 · 15 Jan 2011, 8:09 pm

#821732

Yeah the Porsche lights arnt too bad, but that lower one.... It looks quite strange. Take them back off and then i like where that person is going with the car

Looks like he has the bumper brackets to put the early bumpers on aswell..

Joel Now containing 100\% E-Wang

9,368 posts · joined Feb 2006 · 15 Jan 2011, 8:12 pm

#821733

Yea had deluxe bumpers fitted too

poor thing looks like its got down syndrome

jeremyluke Seriously Crusin Dubber

126 posts · joined Mar 2010 · 15 Jan 2011, 8:17 pm

#821735

I was seriously thinking Down syndrome when i saw it, didnt wanna say it thoguh, in case it was insensitive to somebody on here...

michelineister Learner Dubber

18 posts · joined Jan 2011 · 16 Jan 2011, 2:27 am

#821770

ang on a second..

Ill assume those pics r of bugs with guards that ACCOMODATE the sloping headlights for later models? definately dont want that....I want this (refer pic) love the headlights btw

I would be open to geting a pre 68 for the desired front but but these seem to be scarce and would be waiting around for the right one for a while. Also i wouldnt mind aquiring the perks off the later models & just do guard conversion

Do i cross superbugs off my short list then?

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Paulc1964au Custom Title Time!

1,627 posts · joined Mar 2010 · 16 Jan 2011, 6:51 am

#821774

When I was looking for my bug i wanted a pre 67 but wanted 12 volts, disc brakes, I settled for a 69 that had those options and am pleased with my decision.

In the end it comes down to what you really want the issue of course is how much are you prepared to pay?

/url]Streetwise Aircooled Volkswagens
My 69 Bug

Joel Now containing 100\% E-Wang

9,368 posts · joined Feb 2006 · 16 Jan 2011, 10:14 am

#821790

Those pics I put up were superbugs fitted with wide fiberglass gaurds that have early model headlight buckets.

You can fit early guards to a late model if its not a superbug if its just the early 6volt headlights you want but they do look better if you fit the early bumpers as well.

That red one has the fluted Porsche 911 lights as well but early bug lights just look a bit flatter

Like Paul was saying it's a trade off, early bugs have the "look" but they also have terrible brakes, suspension and electrics, where as the later ones are abit on the plain side to look at (in stock form anyway) but are much nicer to drive.