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Drum Brake Upgrades

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sander288 "Bolt-on Master"

1,404 posts · joined Aug 2008 ·

#975508
First off; I know discs are cheaper, better and require no adjustment, but I need to keep drums to be inside regulations and they need to be stock overall diameter (230mm)

Car: (Aus) 1300 Deluxe Beetle; wide 5, link pins

So; what upgrades are possible to VW drums to make them work a bit better?

wheel cylinders - do 71-92 komib wheel cylinders work on the back or front of 6v cars? Are there other alternative wheel cylinders that work?

Drums: do wide 5 drums from an overseas 1300 (66-67 model) work on link pin spindles with a bearing swap like later discs do. This would be great as they keep the OD but are slightly wider
http://au.vwheritage.com/vw_spares_Brake-drum-front-8-65-8-67-131405615A_act_shop.product_pID_129672.htm?crumbStartPage=1

Shoes: is there a better lining? Do the shoes for the 65-67 models work on 6V cars (presuming the drum goes on)

Cooling: venting the backing plate worthwhile? or cooling rings the go?

TBH there isn't alot of material on the internet on drum upgrades; most replies are the sensible things like either 356 drums or disc upgrades (which I cannot do)

Any help appreciated!

Cheers
Shaun
BMW R65 LS
1967 1300 Deluxe
Swing-axles FTW ❗

1303Steve Scirocco Rare

8,650 posts · joined Aug 2002 ·

#975509
Hi

I used to use taxi linnings on my 63 rally bug, try talking to a local brakes specialist about what they bond to your shoes.

Steve

Governor Wolfsburg Wizard

414 posts · joined Nov 2008 ·

#975513
356 drums bolt straight on

HappyDaze Superannuated

2,887 posts · joined Jun 2009 ·

#975519
Shaun, send me an email - greg@kirrapak.com - and I will give you the contact details of a bloke who can do the best linings. He's in Sydney, but you can post your shoes.

Stock drums will do the job, ideally with al. fins like mine, but use genuine VW drums only....you know why. Get some cool air in through holes and scoops at the front.
I'd rather wear a Beetle out by racing it than by polishing it!

modnrod Fahrvergnugen

978 posts · joined Mar 2011 ·

#975590
Biggest damn wheel cylinders you can squeeze in there. If you can't change the drum diameter, that's all that's left.
If your racing, then shoe area and cooling capacity determines heat capability, which determines fade, so shoe material, cooling slots/holes, the 356 drums are cool as crap, aren't they the ones with massive cooling fins made of alloy?.

vlad01 Compulsive Aussie Vee Dubber

4,270 posts · joined Jun 2010 ·

#975597
I don't know for the front, but I have been told type 3 rear drums are wider. pinch type 3 drums and backing plate + shoes is what a lot of people have used on bugs for rear upgrades.

Don't quote me on the correctness of this, I am only going by what other have said plus the fact I sold type 3 rear brakes who a guy bought it for this reason he told me.

71 notchback,
Past owner of, 70 NB, 73 SB and 72 FB TLE

Newt Wolfsburg Wizard

478 posts · joined Mar 2008 ·

#975598
Worth checking - But from memory, KG front slave cylinders can go in the back (just cant remember the relative size compared to type 3 rear cylinders).

Newt
It is as it is - If you didnt enjoy today, you've missed the opportunity.

dangerous 23 Windows of Awesome

5,901 posts · joined Jan 2005 ·

#975617
There were two versions of early type 3 rear brakes(pre '65)
that had the same diameter as your current wide five Type 1 brakes,
except wider shoes and drums.
this is before the common larger diameter wide five versions that most people want.

The other options are early bus
and possibly Thing, (not sure on diameter there),
which from memory(Thing) are the same diameter, but (T2 have) wider shoes.

I have machined early small spline bus to fit the late (1500 and IRS type 1) backing plates.
I think you will find though,
that both thing and early bus shoes are much wider, yet same diameter.
westi wrote:That's mad Alan.

dangerous 23 Windows of Awesome

5,901 posts · joined Jan 2005 ·

#975618
Not sure about fronts,
but I am sure the type 3 or early bus (or Thing, or even later '70's 1300 type 1) could be adapted.
westi wrote:That's mad Alan.

sander288 "Bolt-on Master"

1,404 posts · joined Aug 2008 ·

#975666
Cheers for the replies guys, got a few things to try

Dave, can you machine aluminium to be shrunk over a drum?
BMW R65 LS
1967 1300 Deluxe
Swing-axles FTW ❗

HappyDaze Superannuated

2,887 posts · joined Jun 2009 ·

#975670
I think there is a set [4] of cast al.fins somewhere in my shed. If not, you can borrow the mould, and get some cast.

They need to be machined for 0.035" interference fit. Leave the drums in the freezer overnight, and heat the fins in the oven enough to slip them over the drums....about 200c ?

The fins help keep the drums nice and round, as well as cool. Stock brakes with good linings and cooling should do the job.
I'd rather wear a Beetle out by racing it than by polishing it!

sander288 "Bolt-on Master"

1,404 posts · joined Aug 2008 ·

#975735
cheers Greg, let me know what you've got floating in the shed.

you've got my email
BMW R65 LS
1967 1300 Deluxe
Swing-axles FTW ❗

HappyDaze Superannuated

2,887 posts · joined Jun 2009 ·

#975757
Found 4 castings...you can have them for what they cost me. Maybe Dangerous can machine - and even fit - them for you?

You will need 4 GOOD drums, and after fins are fitted, machine inside diameter THE SAME LEFT & RIGHT....front and rear diameters ar not so important. The face where the wheel fits could be trued up also. When the drums are finished, have the linings fitted [did you speak to Darren?], and radiused to suit the drums. Bed the drums and linings in carefully - ideally on the road, and not the track.

Clean and grease [RUBBER grease] master and wheel cylinders, even if they are new ones. Make sure the springs are correct, and in good nick. Duct air into the front brakes, and if you aren't using slotted wheels, drill the wheels for air flow.

Cheers, Greg
I'd rather wear a Beetle out by racing it than by polishing it!

Craig Torrens 6 times Australian, 7 times State Hillclimb Class Champion

8,040 posts · joined Jan 2003 ·

#975986
Here's my factory 'upgraded' drum.

Note the extra casting around the outside.

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