Hi Everyone
I recently installed 2.5'' drop spindles to the front of my Standard
70 Beetle. In doing so also replaced the two shocks with new gas stock replacment.
Everything went well with the install no dramas. Now though, i noticed that the drivers side is sitting ALOT lower than the passengers. Rubbing(with spare tyre in). I expected it thinking it would be the tyres yet the other side does not rub.
The difference was probably there before, it just stands out more now.
There is a 25mm difference from gaurd to top tyre. When on jack stands, from tyre to floor has around 7mm difference. I have same size tyres all round.
The rear end measured even on both sides.
Is there any adjustment on the standard front torsion bars? To compensate for the difference.
Reading around it seems the rear can cause alot of issues also seen at the front.
Thanks
"A car for the people, an affordable Volkswagen, would bring great joy to the masses and the problems of building such a car must be faced with courage."
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Eep! there is no separate side adjustments for the height of front torsion leaves.
The camber adjusters at the same position either side? maybe its causing a wheel to 'tuck' in?
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Could be a broken leaf in the front, or it could be the rear set differently from side to side. The rear will diagonally set the front also.
helbus wrote:Could be a broken leaf in the front, or it could be the rear set differently from side to side. The rear will diagonally set the front also.
Is there any way of knowing/testing for broken leaf ?
"A car for the people, an affordable Volkswagen, would bring great joy to the masses and the problems of building such a car must be faced with courage."
Adolf Hitler At opening of 1934 Berlin Auto Show
more than likely its been in a stack over the years and was never repaired correctly
or even the front bulk head has been bent
you should check it from the floor pan as it may have different guards on .
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ian.mezz wrote:you should check it from the floor pan as it may have different guards on .
Yes, well i think they are original guards, but they have certainly had wrk done to them, particaly the pas side. RH side seems pretty much untouched.
I greased the front bar today on all grease nipples until grease came out of the joints. Then jumped up and down to see if the bearings were sticking. If i pull up on the gaurd on the RH side, it will rise to were it is even to other side. If i push down on it, it goes down but does not spring back up.
Not sure how springy the front torsion should be?
Its realy disheartening, nearly had the old girl back on the road. Now it seems to be pointing towards a new front beam.
~~~AHHH Frustrated~~
"A car for the people, an affordable Volkswagen, would bring great joy to the masses and the problems of building such a car must be faced with courage."
Adolf Hitler At opening of 1934 Berlin Auto Show
Sounds like broken leaves.
As you have found, its usually the rear causing the issue.
Jack up the front from the center and measure the rear, should tell you. The reason is the vehicke rear weight bias.
Matt Berry Motorsports...air cooled advice, repairs and mods Ph 0408 704 662
OFF-ROAD,CIRCUIT,DRAG,STREET,ENDURANCE
matberry wrote:As you have found, its usually the rear causing the issue.
Jack up the front from the center and measure the rear, should tell you. The reason is the vehicke rear weight bias.
So jack from center of beam get front wheels off the ground.
Where do i measure from in the rear, just from the floor to gaurd?
Thanks
"A car for the people, an affordable Volkswagen, would bring great joy to the masses and the problems of building such a car must be faced with courage."
Adolf Hitler At opening of 1934 Berlin Auto Show
I just went out to the shed and jacked the beetle up. Took some measurements from ground to center of fender. I draw a basic diagram to help understand and see the measurements i took.
Hope it helps.
"A car for the people, an affordable Volkswagen, would bring great joy to the masses and the problems of building such a car must be faced with courage."
Adolf Hitler At opening of 1934 Berlin Auto Show
By the diagram the rear is out but odd the front is not. I recommend using chassis points to measure from as it is less able to be changed. Many times accident damage is not repaired fully so measuring the panels can be inaccurate.
So at the rear, the best place is at the torsion bar covers, at the lower fwd bolt there is a cast bracket, either the lower edge of the casting, or one of the lower bolts, whatever you feel is easiest and repeatable on both sides.
At the front the beam outer ends/bottom of the shock tower AND the 17mm spanner size bolts at the fwd bulkhead about 400mm rearwad of the beam, as someone mentioned earlier, the framehead of the pan, where front end is bolted, can be missaligned and both these measurements will help determine this.
You need to measure accurately and be on a flat floor.
Matt Berry Motorsports...air cooled advice, repairs and mods Ph 0408 704 662
OFF-ROAD,CIRCUIT,DRAG,STREET,ENDURANCE
Thanks for the detailed help.
The measurements are as follows.
REAR TORSION COVER BOLTS.
LH(bolt 1)- 21.4cm
RH(bolt 1)-21.2cm
LH(bolt 2)-23.5cm
RH(bolt 2)-23.2cm
FRONT BOTTOM SHOCK TOWER
LH- 24.1cm
RH 24 cm
17MM BOLT FLOOR PAN/BULK HEAD
LH - 27 cm
RH- 26.5 cm
From what i see the main difference is the floor pan. 5mm!!
even if i get that 5mm back i still need another 15mm on the drivers side to match the other side.
Thanks again for all your input.
"A car for the people, an affordable Volkswagen, would bring great joy to the masses and the problems of building such a car must be faced with courage."
Adolf Hitler At opening of 1934 Berlin Auto Show
Well done, altho some descrepency, not all that bad. Seems the bodywork/guards are the worst culprit
Matt Berry Motorsports...air cooled advice, repairs and mods Ph 0408 704 662
OFF-ROAD,CIRCUIT,DRAG,STREET,ENDURANCE
matberry wrote:Well done, altho some descrepency, not all that bad. Seems the bodywork/guards are the worst culprit
Thats what i thought, surely a couple mm here and there isnt too bad. The floor pan doesnt look too bad, as in major previous damgage.
So i guess the next step would be to work out how to even out the guards?
"A car for the people, an affordable Volkswagen, would bring great joy to the masses and the problems of building such a car must be faced with courage."
Adolf Hitler At opening of 1934 Berlin Auto Show
jjwebb123 wrote:I greased the front bar today on all grease nipples until grease came out of the joints. Then jumped up and down to see if the bearings were sticking. If i pull up on the gaurd on the RH side, it will rise to were it is even to other side. If i push down on it, it goes down but does not spring back up.
I would be concerned about this if I have interpreted it correctly, something is going on here.....
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Check and see if the rear has different camber?? assuming the rear has been lowered? if it does then reset the rear torsion bars and arms.
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Special Air Service wrote:jjwebb123 wrote:I greased the front bar today on all grease nipples until grease came out of the joints. Then jumped up and down to see if the bearings were sticking. If i pull up on the gaurd on the RH side, it will rise to were it is even to other side. If i push down on it, it goes down but does not spring back up.
I would be concerned about this if I have interpreted it correctly, something is going on here.....
Marvelous....you've solved the problem !
I'd rather wear a Beetle out by racing it than by polishing it!
matberry wrote:As you have found, its usually the rear causing the issue.
Jack up the front from the center and measure the rear, should tell you. The reason is the vehicke rear weight bias.
This has been the reason for all my crook bugs. but as mentioned, panels after repair are never perfect. a few MM in an old car imo is perfectly fine.
check the front leaves for brokens, and straighten out the rear
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I managed to lift rh gaurd to avoid rubbing at pace. it still rubs
at full lock and slight left hand turns at speed. (body roll).
Its driveable although I would like to further improve it.
is it a simple step to check leaf/spring integrity? ??????
"A car for the people, an affordable Volkswagen, would bring great joy to the masses and the problems of building such a car must be faced with courage."
Adolf Hitler At opening of 1934 Berlin Auto Show
jjwebb123 wrote:is it a simple step to check leaf/spring integrity? ??????
No, trailing arms and then leaf pack need to be removed to check
Matt Berry Motorsports...air cooled advice, repairs and mods Ph 0408 704 662
OFF-ROAD,CIRCUIT,DRAG,STREET,ENDURANCE
matberry wrote:jjwebb123 wrote:is it a simple step to check leaf/spring integrity? ??????
No, trailing arms and then leaf pack need to be removed to check
Can new leaf packs be purchased and replaced?
It tends to make sense that after 44 years with someone sitting on one side that there would be more wear on that side.
"A car for the people, an affordable Volkswagen, would bring great joy to the masses and the problems of building such a car must be faced with courage."
Adolf Hitler At opening of 1934 Berlin Auto Show
