Some of you might remember a post I made (pre crash) about another forum I am on getting served with writs regarding alleged libel (defamation).
Well... After quarter million dollar suits against 2 administrators and 10 members a long standing forum is closing down. Most of them members of the organisation whose funds are being used to sue them!
One of the administrators is pretty much having to wind up his business as a result.
The loss to the Hot Rodding movement of Australia should serve as warning to people here. HOLD YOUR TONGUES IF THERE IS ANY CHANCE WHAT YOU WRITE IS LIBELLIOUS.
Freedom of speech so long as you only say what is allowed. Sad.:cussing
Thats bad to hear.............................
What is the world coming to !!!
If you'd voiced your opions down the good old pub and someone didn't like it ya might have had a little brawl but nothing like to day on this magic machine!!!!!!!!!!
Da Time For The Aircooled Revolution Is Upon US.
Brothers & Sisters Lets Hit The Streets, Roll As One. And Feel The Power Of The Aircooled Storm.
ancientbugger wrote:Freedom of speech so long as you only say what is allowed. Sad.:cussing
You can say whatever you want, so long as you say it respectfully and without slander.
Squiz....
Unfortunately that is the cost we have to bear in an ever-growing litigeous society
Yep, you can sue someone for anything these days.
A growing 'blame' culture.....
ancientbugger wrote:Freedom of speech so long as you only say what is allowed. Sad.:cussing
You should have the right to defend your reputation though.
Ok, I'm going down the other path here.
Depends on the context of what happened. We can't automatically assume this was a bad thing
For example say I run XYZ business, and some person on this forum decides to defame me for something I didn't do. The moderators do nothing about it and as a result my business suffers. What action should I take?
While the fact this other forum is closing may seem bad, we know nothing of the context.
The context is this... without adding myself to the 12 already facing $250,000 suits
A national non-profit organisation recently appointed an executive to be national director where previously a member of the organisation was elected as head.
The discussion has been based around the association's management and use of member funds. A number of members have expressed disquite about an alleged number of steps taken to change the organisation and use large sums of the organisations money for purposes that were not voted on or even expressed to the members until after the fact.
Several members apparently have sought legal advice regarding the management of the organisation in relation to the Incorporations Act and reveled those investigations.
The short of it is that the executive has issued libel notice because members of the organisation have made comment about "their organisation" and political/business practices occuring.
The entire discussion has not been withdrawn and will be available until the forum is closed later this week.
While the libel proceedings appear to be lodged in QLD (which has the harshest defmation laws) the forum is based in Victoria and the organisation is registered in South Australia. The allegations and likelyhood of success for the complainant do not seem high but those named cannot afford to fight it the forum will close. The complainant of course will be able to use member funds to sue members for voicing concerns about their organisation. Even with the closing of the forum there is no guarantee that the proceedings will stop.
Someone instigating defamation proceedings doesn't have to win to close you down/bankrupt you. Nor does their complaint even have to have a likelyhood of winning. Defamation law doesn't allow truth and proof to be used as a defence.
so wheres the link?
everything dies baby, thats a fact..
maybe everything that dies one day comes back..
put your make up on and your hair up pretty..
and meet me tonight in Atlantic city..
okay, it maybe me, BUT:
even if what someone says is slander, then surely the forum moderators should have the invite the person who wrote the comments to immedately withdraw them, and if not, advise the person who is making claims of slander.
If the person who wrote them refuses to withdraw, then the person sueing should only be sueing the person who wrote it, not the forum moderators.
The forum, as far as I can see, should only be seen as a palce that allows ppl with a common interest to 'chat' A place for comments.
If we were at a pub, and someone made the comment, you sue the person, not the pub. So why sue a forum, and not the person who made the comment??
Give me a break.
It sucks
maybe the forum here should have a complete disclaimer at the front page
Ie: the opinions held within are those of the forum emebers, not the forum moderators. Whilst we will invite ppl who have been seen to make slanderous remarks to remove those statements, the refusal to do so by those persons, will not in any way be the responsibility of the forum, it's moderators, or other members. etc etc etc.
In other words, just cause someone made a nasty remark abotu a person shouldn't give that person the right to sue everyone and anyone until they get some money from someone.
Just my thoughts.
d4
dubless. 🥲
🥷 And who the helled parked the Mitsubishi "Prancer" under my house??? 🥷
In some circumstances truth is a defence, but only on ground that whatever is being said is a matter of pulic interest
What about a phone company. I see the forum as a means of communication. a way for me to pass knowledge, comments, ideas and views to other ppl. Does that mean if i was to slander a person over the phone, that the phone company could be sued? or is it because this leaves a more permenent copy of slander?
Umm its all very wrong. as gibbo said a blame society. We just had a person sue and win a case(in brissy) as the bmx jump she road over and crashed on was felt to be to big and she was able to get to much speed into it. yet she just won a court case for damages.
Mabye the laws governing the internet, chat rooms, forums, etc need to be updated (nationally) so that this sort of thing can be ruled out?
[Edited on 23-2-2005 by BiX]
I have no sympathy for my car, only the wallet that pays for it!
Go hard or go home!!!!
~air fooled~ wrote:so wheres the link?
u2u me for detail. I use the same username here as there and I don't want to get "followed".
Disclaimers don't mean shit. Pure and simple.
The administrators are seen by the law as the publishers.
As the web is available anywhere the party initiating the processes is able to choose the juristiction that best suits them.
thats not so easy Bix coz everyone around the world can access the forum and they are not constrained by the laws of another country
bugeyedbabe wrote:In other words, just cause someone made a nasty remark abotu a person shouldn't give that person the right to sue everyone and anyone until they get some money from someone.
It's not just about saying things that are nasty. Slander is about making false and malicious statements that injure a person's reputation. The right to sue somebody for making libellous comments should exist, but the manner in which it's done should be fair for both parties.
As an example, in the early days of Virgin Airways, Richard Branson was being personally attacked by the head of BA. If he hadn't finally decided to sue BA for slander, Virgin Airways and possibly the entire group might not be around today. Obviously this is in a different league though.
The problem is that comments posted on forums fall under the "tests" that the High Court uses to determine slander and Libel.
It must be published, it must relate to the person or their company and it must injure their reputation
no words are worth ruining someones life...
bugeyedbabe wrote:If the person who wrote them refuses to withdraw, then the person sueing should only be sueing the person who wrote it,
d4
try and find them! it wouldn't be that easy.
Keeping it real !
Queen_Bug wrote:The problem is that comments posted on forums fall under the "tests" that the High Court uses to determine slander and Libel.
It must be published, it must relate to the person or their company and it must injure their reputation
The high court doesn't get jurisdiction until appeal. The states supreme courts handle it first. The costs to even get the case to prove reasonable or to argue public interest will destroy most defendants.
matt i heard about this just today.
People just don't get it do they, dumb lawsuits. Next thing you know, we'll be handing out guns, driving on the other side of the road and hoisting the stars and stripes...
"oh say can you see, by the dawns early light..." that the rest of the world will go to up the crapper if they follow in the footsteps of the yanks.
Sorry Matt, I hope it all turns out ok for you and your mates. 🙁
[Edited on 23-2-2005 by pete wood]
another example of technology outstripping the laws common sence process
Sorry Matt, I hope it all turns out ok for you and your mates.
Thankfully I am not on "the list". One of the few times I have kept my mouth closed and glad I did!
I know a few of the guys that are and well they ain't comfortable at all.
So I guess the lesson here for us is either dont say something that could be libellious and to mention/report posts that could be straight away - a quick edit or retraction could save the skin of not just yourself but also the admins and the forum...
Hadn't been there in a while but got a rundown from bcal the other day.......:o
Spyder-WISD 07-09-05 11.6s @ 125 MPH
Speedster-WISD Nats 05 14.4s @ 89 MPH
Jet cruiser-Coogee 22-09-05 900 deg C @ 110,000 rpm
Weaseling out of things is what separates us from the animals....................Except the Weasel.
I'm getting legal advice - I've written an e-mail to two legal friends, one who operates in the intellectual property / cybercrime space in Australia and works with some of the best defamation lawyers in the business.
If the advice comes back that I can't protect myself, then I'm afraid you'll have to find another forum.
Andrew
I hope it doesn't come to that Andrew...
but if it does....
I'm sure We will all understand.... as None of Us wants to be on the other end of a law suit either....
Best of luck.....
Shouldn't this be just looked at as a "NOTICE BOARD" ???
and it shouldn't have anything to do with the person who "actually" owns the notice board..... IMHO...
but I'm NOT a lawyer......
and as Andrew doesn't look or check every POSTING on this forum he shouldn't be held responsible for what other people post.... [I know this probably isn't the Law]
Lee -
- Helping keep Air Cooled VWs on the road - location: SCONE in the Upper Hunter Valley - Northern NSW 320 kms NNW of SYDNEY---
Is this really Australia, how weak are some PPL. Stand on your own two feet and take it like a man. What happened to those principals. I am ashamed to see the way our PPL are going...:o
Rob...😎
Boxer Power
Member of DMLRK.....Die Mittler Lebuns Resto Komeradschaft
