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New cars don't need maintenance right??

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Joel Now containing 100\% E-Wang

9,368 posts · joined Feb 2006 ·

#865197
Seems some people think that way.

I know I'm kinda guilty, my ex's Corolla when I was responsible for maintaince of it got driven 74,000kms without an oil change but it was topped up a few times so was reasonably fresh.
I was in the mindset of "can't kill a Toyota" and hey it proved true, thing still ran like clockwork.

But I thought people may get a laugh from this one though.
I called into John Shermans to pick up some brake stuff and he's like Stan, been in VW cirlces for so long and just loves a good chat about them, I was there over an hour just catching up.

Anyway he was showing me all that's new and great, including his latest adaptor kit.
Someone hit him up to make a VW adaptor kit to fit the V6 lump out of the current VE Commondoore.

Naturally he needed a engine to mock it up with and the one he's got is a classic example of the dumbass oblivious modern driver with more dollars than sense.

It's out of a 2007 VE Commodore and the guy that owned the car bought it and never once changed the oil!
Just drove it till it died.
By the looks the timing chain let go.

I've seen some pretty neglected engines before including that E46 BMW driven for 100,000kms with no oil change -

http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum/showthread.php?s=a280632a5fe4d905e6834fdb8c77cdd5&t=1281659

But this one was something else.
It doesn't look so bad from the bottom with the sump off, just little bit sludgy.




But it's under the rocker covers you can really see the carnage.
Bear in mind this is only a 4 year old engine, exact KMs unknown but apparently it wasn't high.






Looking closely it's like someone took a container of grease, added a few cups of dirt and went to town.

Oil is cheap, much cheaper than engines, I don't get some peoples logic.



bugmaniaar Officially Full-On Dubber

295 posts · joined Jun 2011 ·

#865202
Holly Crap....
Better go change the oil in the wifes magna......

waveman1500 Also rides a Honda

1,346 posts · joined Dec 2009 ·

#865216
That's pretty nasty. I reckon that going 4 years without any servicing at all is a pretty good achievement for a DOHC engine though! Lots of bits in there to gum up. I change the oil on my modern car at 5,000km intervals and feel guilty stretching it out to 6,000km! However, I am partly guilty of skimping on maintenance because I generally only change the oil and oil filter. The air filter gets a tap out over the bin every four or five services if I feel particularly keen and I usually leave the sparkplugs alone altogether. About 10 or 15,000km ago I reset the gaps on them and put them back in, they're probably a couple of years old. At least it gets clean oil though! So far it hasn't given me much trouble. Having said that, the car is 21 years old so giving it the full maintenance schedule isn't particularly worth it to me. If the old spark-plugs are still firing perfectly then why change them?
1972 VW S-Bug - For Sale!
1968-onwards Beetle panels and glass for sale

Camo Custom Title Time!

1,936 posts · joined Oct 2007 ·

#865280
Yet Holden themselves, don't change oil until every 15,000kms. And this is by the book and still covers warranty.

Kev
I thought rebuilding a VW would be cheap - Shit I was wrong, just don't let the wife know !!!!

Click here for my (slowy) modded 1961 Beetle build.

68AutoBug Beetle Restorer - Experience over 138\% - YIKES --

11,654 posts · joined Aug 2002 ·

#865299
I had two CE lancers

First one was 1997 GLXI 1835cc and second one the same 2002 model but the oil change was different on the second car ...
it might have been 10,000 and then 15,000klms..

both cars were identical mechanically..

I still changed the oil and filter every 6000klms.. on both cars..
changed spark plugs every year...
cleaned air filter then fitted K & N air filter which was cleanable

had no problems... with either cars..
changed the coolant every 3 years...
Nulon additive in the transmission..

Lee
- Helping keep Air Cooled VWs on the road - location: SCONE in the Upper Hunter Valley - Northern NSW 320 kms NNW of SYDNEY---

ryana89 Officially Full-On Dubber

315 posts · joined Sep 2009 ·

#865342
People always come into work and ask the question "how often should I change my oil" (Im tooo lazy to open the glovebox and read the manual)
The look of horror on their face when the reply is "ever 5 - 10 thousand" is always an eye roller.

Poor little VE.
2.0slow 92 MK2

Made in Germany, Assembled in Africa, 'Migrated' to Australia

waveman1500 Also rides a Honda

1,346 posts · joined Dec 2009 ·

#865368
Well, I went and bought two bottles of oil and two oil filters today after reading this thread! One for my Nissan, which was due a service anyway, and one for my Holden, which I've only just bought and have no service history on. As this thread reminds us, for the sake of about $20 for a bottle of oil, $10 for a filter and less than an hour of my time, it's worth doing the services.

Camo, I also agree that the logbook service intervals on modern cars are far too long for my liking. However, the engineers responsible have done a lot of testing to make sure that the engine will survive without durability issues at the recommended interval. Better safe than sorry though. The one which I find the worst is the fact that there is no oil change at the first service! On most new cars, the first service occurs at about 3000km or so. However, all this involves is a general inspection of the car and re-tensioning of any drive belts if necessary. The first scheduled oil change is usually not until 15,000km after the first engine start! If I bought a new car, I would definitely be changing the oil at the first service.
1972 VW S-Bug - For Sale!
1968-onwards Beetle panels and glass for sale

ratty 63 Custom Title Time!

1,083 posts · joined Oct 2003 ·

#865424
waveman1500 wrote:... However, the engineers responsible have done a lot of testing to make sure that the engine will survive without durability issues at the recommended interval....
That probably should read "...the engineers responsible have done a lot of testing to make sure that the engine will survive until the end of the warranty period without durability issues at the recommended interval...."

Lets face it - if they can ensure that your engine will only last 7 to 10 years, they don't have to pay out for warranty claims, it makes it appear cheaper to purchase and maintain a new car and, by the time the car is on to its third owner it is basically worn out and not worth anything they will sell more new cars more easily.

My parents have two 1993 Hyundai Excels in their extensive fleet - both look and drive like they are still new. They both have over 200K on the clock but have been serviced (read: oil and filter changed) religiously every 5000km. My wifes 1993 Pulsar is exactly the same, yet one of the guys I work with has a 2004 Toyota Camery that rarely enjoys any maintenance and it is smokey, rattly and unreliable. He was shocked that I changed the oil in my cars every 5000km - he can't remember the last time he changed his oil, but it was over 50000km ago! 🤪

For the cost of basic maintenance and when you consider the amount of work your car does, it is well worth the effort and expense of changing the oil and filter regularly.

R 🙂
40hp, 6V and ...er... slowly making improvements 😂

It's nice to be important, but it's more important to be nice!

Founding member of the Gold Coast Dub Club Inc. 🙂

Joel Now containing 100\% E-Wang

9,368 posts · joined Feb 2006 ·

#865429
Exactly, it all comes down to proper maintenance.

Another example of that, I testdrove/inspected a 96 Excel for a friend a few months back that had 388,000kms on the clock but had belonged to the wife of a mechanic and had been religiously maintained.
I could sense the KMs in the steering, suspension and gearshift but mechanically the engine was running like clockwork, a huge feat considering the cruddy mitsubishi engines in those things give alot of trouble/short life span, and yes still original.

The EJ22 in the subi joints Subaru Liberty shop car has around 420,000km on it, never beeen touched aside from seals and timing belts and my mates 68 bug has clocked up 200,000miles since the engine went in back in 96 on its 1500 single port with only a head freshen up.

Love your car, it'll love you back 😂

bajachris88 The international telephone dialing code for Antarctica is 6

6,661 posts · joined Apr 2005 ·

#865437
I nabbed some good wisdom from a jdm engine expert from ipswich road and track, and the whole 'lack of maintenance' and crazy sludge is something VERY common to see in import jdm motors, despite them being low km. best to look under the rocker covers for the sludge prior to purchase from the importer, otherwise the low km engine won't last all that great.

In regards to engine longevity i have to mention Lucus oil stabiliser, i stand by this stuff. Theres even a classic vw testimonial going around (not my own) where an oil pump failure lead to zero oil pressure (oil pump shaft broke) whilst in the middle of high rpm driving (racing), and upon tear down nothing in regards to wear due to lack of lubrication (from loss of oil pressure) could not be found as the stabiliser maintained a film on all the bearings etc.
(ô_!_/ô) (ô_!_/ô)
69' baja: kombi box, thing spindles, irs, disc front, type 3 rear drums, 2 inch lift kit, 31x10 rears. 👍
New engine in process: 94mm p&bs, 74mm C/w chomol Crank, 35.5x39 SP heads, turbo. Wierd combo, hopeful torque monsta!

waveman1500 Also rides a Honda

1,346 posts · joined Dec 2009 ·

#865481
ratty 63, I am sure that engines will last longer with more frequent oil changes, but for a new car buyer, servicing every 5000km is excessive. Given that most new car buyers are keeping their car for 3-5 years and getting all of their servicing done at dealerships for $250-$750 a service, I would advise them all to stick to the logbook! After all, modern oils and oil filters have advanced a long way in the last 20 years. Not only are the oils far better than ever, but the local manufacturers have been progressively enlarging the oil capacity of their sumps in order to lengthen the service interval and make the car more attractive to fleet buyers. The VE Alloytec engine, for example, takes 6.5 litres of oil! That's a lot, and the Falcon sumps take even more. With a modern engine there is less blow-by and wear to contaminate the oil, so it will last longer. Add all of this up and 15,000km is not unrealistic.
1972 VW S-Bug - For Sale!
1968-onwards Beetle panels and glass for sale

vlad01 Compulsive Aussie Vee Dubber

4,270 posts · joined Jun 2010 ·

#865510
Camo wrote:Yet Holden themselves, don't change oil until every 15,000kms. And this is by the book and still covers warranty.

Kev
thats f**king bs!

minimum 5,000-7,000ks I say.

the V6s had the tiniest oil pickup strainer so any sludge/dirt quickly blocked them up. check this classic example, oil hardly changed, thrashed to the shit house, failed at 383,000km 🥲



mind you this still ran in this state lol.

71 notchback,
Past owner of, 70 NB, 73 SB and 72 FB TLE

waveman1500 Also rides a Honda

1,346 posts · joined Dec 2009 ·

#865524
vlad01 wrote:check this classic example, oil hardly changed, thrashed to the shit house, failed at 383,000km 🥲
Minimal maintenance, thrashing and still living to 383,000km? That sounds pretty good to me! I don't think that any car owner could complain at that. Not only that, but I seriously doubt that an air-cooled VW motor could survive for that long with similar abuse!
1972 VW S-Bug - For Sale!
1968-onwards Beetle panels and glass for sale

RISKY4LIFE Officially Full-On Dubber

308 posts · joined Jul 2010 ·

#865621
waveman1500 wrote:ratty 63, I am sure that engines will last longer with more frequent oil changes, but for a new car buyer, servicing every 5000km is excessive. Given that most new car buyers are keeping their car for 3-5 years and getting all of their servicing done at dealerships for $250-$750 a service, I would advise them all to stick to the logbook! After all, modern oils and oil filters have advanced a long way in the last 20 years. Not only are the oils far better than ever, but the local manufacturers have been progressively enlarging the oil capacity of their sumps in order to lengthen the service interval and make the car more attractive to fleet buyers. The VE Alloytec engine, for example, takes 6.5 litres of oil! That's a lot, and the Falcon sumps take even more. With a modern engine there is less blow-by and wear to contaminate the oil, so it will last longer. Add all of this up and 15,000km is not unrealistic.
im with you 5k is to often for most driving conditions
in a new car 10 - 15 with good oils and large sumps