Banshee777 Commited Dubber
74 posts · joined Jun 2015 ·
No, I haven't got the flywheel on yet.
Engine bush build
psimitar Son of Jim - Creator of Good
2,506 posts · joined Jan 2009 ·
So before fitting the pistons and barrels you should have set the endfloat by fitting 2 shims and then torquing up the flywheel so you can measure the enfloat with a dial gauge. Then whatever endfloat you have minus 0.1mm and that's the thickness of shim required or change all three shims to get as close as possible to this figure. I use 0.09-0.1mm to set endfloat as manual says between 0.07-0.15mm.Banshee777 wrote:No, I haven't got the flywheel on yet.
Pistons on causes drag on the rods so you can't get a good dial gauge reading. 🙂
madness is in the eye of the beholder 👍
Banshee777 Commited Dubber
74 posts · joined Jun 2015 ·
Ok, I have't done it that way. With the flywheel on will the end play be reduced and allow the distributor drive to turn properly, and I can then set end play properly?. I'm a bit hung up on the distributor part not rotating freely at the moment.
psimitar Son of Jim - Creator of Good
2,506 posts · joined Jan 2009 ·
With the flywheel on and endfloat ser correctly the crank can't move as much back and forth in the case so it should stop the dizzy drive from Binding. Should being the operative word here.
trouble is the barrel s can't be on to allow correct setting of the endfloat. There's unfortunately a set way to assemble an engine and doing it the wrong way will just lead to problems in the future and cost you more time and money.
trouble is the barrel s can't be on to allow correct setting of the endfloat. There's unfortunately a set way to assemble an engine and doing it the wrong way will just lead to problems in the future and cost you more time and money.
madness is in the eye of the beholder 👍
Banshee777 Commited Dubber
74 posts · joined Jun 2015 ·
Thanks Psimitar, looks like I'll be taking it apart again.
*Update*
So I've followed different build instructions from different people and have mixed the order up.
following this one:
http://www.superbeetles.com/performance101/performance101.htm
I should not have put the distributor in yet even though he does the end play after putting the cylinders on.
The other ones do the end play and then install the distributor and then the pistons etc.
Long story short - no distributor until the end-play is done....at least I think so.
*Update*
So I've followed different build instructions from different people and have mixed the order up.
following this one:
http://www.superbeetles.com/performance101/performance101.htm
I should not have put the distributor in yet even though he does the end play after putting the cylinders on.
The other ones do the end play and then install the distributor and then the pistons etc.
Long story short - no distributor until the end-play is done....at least I think so.
psimitar Son of Jim - Creator of Good
2,506 posts · joined Jan 2009 ·
Do you have a workshop manual to do by or do you need a few pointers for the crank/cam/dizzy alignment? After that the rest is pretty straightforward 🙂
madness is in the eye of the beholder 👍
Banshee777 Commited Dubber
74 posts · joined Jun 2015 ·
Thanks, yes I'm using a Haynes workshop manual and various sources around the web. I can't blame the sources it's me that is making the mistakes but that is what I set out to do.
I've used the dragracingTV videos on youtube as I found them quite good. That's what I used for setting the distributor drive alignment but when I go back and look again - he has the flywheel on.😵💫😵💫😵💫 I just hope I haven't wrecked the distributor drive gear by the time I get it right.
I've used the dragracingTV videos on youtube as I found them quite good. That's what I used for setting the distributor drive alignment but when I go back and look again - he has the flywheel on.😵💫😵💫😵💫 I just hope I haven't wrecked the distributor drive gear by the time I get it right.
psimitar Son of Jim - Creator of Good
2,506 posts · joined Jan 2009 ·
Nah, so long as you didn't force the motor turning when it went tight then should be fine. At worst you'll have made a slight low spot in the drive gears at the binding point but hopefully nothing noticeable.
I've seen some VW engine builders put the dizzy drive gear in when putting the crank in but altho a PITA to get it in the right place sometimes I find it better to do after setting the endfloat 🙂
I've seen some VW engine builders put the dizzy drive gear in when putting the crank in but altho a PITA to get it in the right place sometimes I find it better to do after setting the endfloat 🙂
madness is in the eye of the beholder 👍
adlbeetle66 Under the car.........again!
1,476 posts · joined Aug 2014 ·
Using the Haynes manual is good, but i have found the Compleat Idiots Book is great! JMO
Banshee777 Commited Dubber
74 posts · joined Jun 2015 ·
One step forward and then ten steps backwards.
I put the flywheel on and a lot of my end play disappeared, my rough calculations put it at .009", so need another shim for the stack. I decided to fit the oil pump......what a cluster-.... on my part.
Put the housing in the right way and tapped it in with a hammer and wood with about a 5mm gap left to go. Then put on the cover and torqued it down to get it sealed.....mmmmm....not too keen on the bow in the pump plate. And the crank is jammed, won't turn.❗
Looks like the extra 110 camshaft that I had in the boxes and decided to throw in the engine has fouled the pump and I've destroyed the body taking it out. Took the whole thing apart again, split the cases and installed the std. cam. Now I need a new pump and cover.😠😠😠
State of the pump housing with the flange splitting from the body and the cover plate with a new impression and bowed.
I put the flywheel on and a lot of my end play disappeared, my rough calculations put it at .009", so need another shim for the stack. I decided to fit the oil pump......what a cluster-.... on my part.
Put the housing in the right way and tapped it in with a hammer and wood with about a 5mm gap left to go. Then put on the cover and torqued it down to get it sealed.....mmmmm....not too keen on the bow in the pump plate. And the crank is jammed, won't turn.❗
Looks like the extra 110 camshaft that I had in the boxes and decided to throw in the engine has fouled the pump and I've destroyed the body taking it out. Took the whole thing apart again, split the cases and installed the std. cam. Now I need a new pump and cover.😠😠😠
State of the pump housing with the flange splitting from the body and the cover plate with a new impression and bowed.
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Banshee777 Commited Dubber
74 posts · joined Jun 2015 ·
And this is where the cam bolt was fouling the pump body, and the damage my Neanderthal hammering did with driving the bolt head into the body and pushing the shaft into the cover plate.
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ragged Just ask if you need HELP!
478 posts · joined Jan 2005 ·
the original cam was most likely a 'dished cam gear', with the oil pump to suit.
The 110 cam is a 'flat cam gear'. If you need to replace the oil pump, use the 110 cam and buy an oil pump to suit the flat cam.
At least you now know there are 2 types! And all after market cams use the flat gear. Dave
The 110 cam is a 'flat cam gear'. If you need to replace the oil pump, use the 110 cam and buy an oil pump to suit the flat cam.
At least you now know there are 2 types! And all after market cams use the flat gear. Dave
Banshee777 Commited Dubber
74 posts · joined Jun 2015 ·
Old dished cam is back in along with a new pump to match. End play is sorted and the main seal and flywheel are on. Distributor drive is still giving me grief with 3 tight spots.
psimitar Son of Jim - Creator of Good
2,506 posts · joined Jan 2009 ·
When you say dizzy drive do you mean the shaft that the dizzy offset drive lug fits into or are you on about the cam drive gear?
Just want to make sure plus ask if you checked both the crank and cam seperately for free rotation before then trying them together and again checking for free rotation?
If it is just the dizzy worm drive then could be it needs another shim or in your previous attempts you've bruised the soft crank dizzy drive gear and that's causing the tight spots.
Just want to make sure plus ask if you checked both the crank and cam seperately for free rotation before then trying them together and again checking for free rotation?
If it is just the dizzy worm drive then could be it needs another shim or in your previous attempts you've bruised the soft crank dizzy drive gear and that's causing the tight spots.
madness is in the eye of the beholder 👍
Banshee777 Commited Dubber
74 posts · joined Jun 2015 ·
It's the dizzy worm drive. I have one shim in there already but I think I damaged the dizzy drive gear and that is causing the problems. Will try an additional shim.
psimitar Son of Jim - Creator of Good
2,506 posts · joined Jan 2009 ·
Ah. Yea, as I said the soft bronze can be easily bruised. If you find the bruising you could file them away but that would induce extra backlash. Still, if doing this on a budget it'll work for a good long while I'd think 🙂
madness is in the eye of the beholder 👍
Banshee777 Commited Dubber
74 posts · joined Jun 2015 ·
I already filed and peened the worst of the damage when I put the drive gear on the crank but I guess I didn't get it all. I think I'll just forge ahead and see what happens....
psimitar Son of Jim - Creator of Good
2,506 posts · joined Jan 2009 ·
The harder steel dizzy drive will very quickly flatten those tight spots out altho I can't say if it will end well. I'd defo do an oil change and filter clean after not many miles to remove any bronze shavings from the oil.
madness is in the eye of the beholder 👍
Banshee777 Commited Dubber
74 posts · joined Jun 2015 ·
Another bit of work on the engine today and we're getting closer to the moment of truth - will it start and how long before it dies......
The pressure plate and clutch are the wrong size and don't fit so not sure what is happening there. I should be able to still fit to the gearbox to start it. I put an extra 2 shims into the distributor drive gear and it seems a bit happier. Exhaust is yet to go on and I have to figure out how to fit the alternator pulley. Carb linkages seem to be half there so will have to rummage through the parts boxes and try and find the rest.
The pressure plate and clutch are the wrong size and don't fit so not sure what is happening there. I should be able to still fit to the gearbox to start it. I put an extra 2 shims into the distributor drive gear and it seems a bit happier. Exhaust is yet to go on and I have to figure out how to fit the alternator pulley. Carb linkages seem to be half there so will have to rummage through the parts boxes and try and find the rest.
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psimitar Son of Jim - Creator of Good
2,506 posts · joined Jan 2009 ·
🙂
madness is in the eye of the beholder 👍
Old Dubber Wolfsburg Wizard
605 posts · joined Aug 2002 ·
Your alternator pulley is on back the front. The piece with the "slots" fits on first over the shaft, so that it's on the back.
Grahame
visit my club site at www.vwdcqinc.org.au
visit my club site at www.vwdcqinc.org.au
Banshee777 Commited Dubber
74 posts · joined Jun 2015 ·
Thanks OD, I've switched it around.
Banshee777 Commited Dubber
74 posts · joined Jun 2015 ·
Engine is mounted but no clutch or pressure plate. Next weekend will be the moment of truth. Still to go: set firing order, oil, petrol, wire the coil, find a battery.
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Banshee777 Commited Dubber
74 posts · joined Jun 2015 ·
I've hit on the next problem. All oiled up, firing order is set, exhaust is on, new battery.......and it can barely turnover. With the spark plugs out it will spin like crazy. I think I have too much compression and may not have set the deck height correctly (aka not at all).
psimitar Son of Jim - Creator of Good
2,506 posts · joined Jan 2009 ·
Check that the engine turn by hand easily first. Why, cos if the wrong endfloat shims are fitted then it'll make the engine REAL tight to turn.
How do I know this? From experience 🙂
How do I know this? From experience 🙂
madness is in the eye of the beholder 👍
vlad01 Compulsive Aussie Vee Dubber
4,270 posts · joined Jun 2010 ·
Paint stripper and a hose off will get them cleaner than that and no effort at all.adlbeetle66 wrote:You're certainly good with your WD40 and sand paper! 👍
71 notchback,
Past owner of, 70 NB, 73 SB and 72 FB TLE
Banshee777 Commited Dubber
74 posts · joined Jun 2015 ·
Thanks PSimitar. If it cranks easily with the plugs out would that not indicate that the end float is not the issue? I really don't want to take the heads off for the 5th time.
psimitar Son of Jim - Creator of Good
2,506 posts · joined Jan 2009 ·
Heads won't need to come off. I'm meaning the endfloat shims on the flywheel.
If the engine turns fairly easy by hand then incorrect shims isn't the reason for slow cranking. Next I'd do a compression check as that sure can make an engine spin slowly if the comp is high.
If the engine turns fairly easy by hand then incorrect shims isn't the reason for slow cranking. Next I'd do a compression check as that sure can make an engine spin slowly if the comp is high.
madness is in the eye of the beholder 👍
Banshee777 Commited Dubber
74 posts · joined Jun 2015 ·
I meant take the heads off for a copper gasket or a shim under the jugs to lower the compression.
I tried it by hand just now and it's easy enough until it starts to compress and then gets a bit harder, you can hear the compression end and a little whoosh and then it becomes easier again.
My interest is really starting to wane now and I'm thinking of selling it. The engine was fun (and I'd still like to see it start) but I just can't devote the time to working on the body.
I tried it by hand just now and it's easy enough until it starts to compress and then gets a bit harder, you can hear the compression end and a little whoosh and then it becomes easier again.
My interest is really starting to wane now and I'm thinking of selling it. The engine was fun (and I'd still like to see it start) but I just can't devote the time to working on the body.
psimitar Son of Jim - Creator of Good
2,506 posts · joined Jan 2009 ·
Shame you're loosing interest after putting the effort into the engine.
As for the barrel shims, yes. Just need a syringe so you can accurately measure the combustion chamber. The barrel is obvioulsy the easy bit to measure 🙂
It's hard to say without turning the engine myself if it's high compression but from what you've said it's not tight and the wrong endfloat shims would make it tight all the way round.
If the battery is not in good health then not only will the motor turn slowly but can also lead to a weak spark due to voltage drop. this in turn means it's even harder for the engine to start.
As for the barrel shims, yes. Just need a syringe so you can accurately measure the combustion chamber. The barrel is obvioulsy the easy bit to measure 🙂
It's hard to say without turning the engine myself if it's high compression but from what you've said it's not tight and the wrong endfloat shims would make it tight all the way round.
If the battery is not in good health then not only will the motor turn slowly but can also lead to a weak spark due to voltage drop. this in turn means it's even harder for the engine to start.
madness is in the eye of the beholder 👍