Big brakes for Beetle NOW WITH EVEN MORE PICS!!

VWCOOL · 2005-03-29T02:27:46+00:00

For the last year or so, I have been developing a big brake package for the front end of BJ Beetles that I hope to manufacture and sell to other VW enthusiasts. Yesterday, I fitted my prototype package to the front end of my hottie Oval for road testing so I thought I'd take a few pics... This upgrade consists of modified spindles and a hub and calliper bracket machined from billet. The calliper I have chosen is the common, low-cost and very effective single-piston sliding finned aluminium PBR Corvette/Holden calliper, commonly known as the 'VL Turbo' calliper used on VL-VS Holden/HSV V8s. The disc is a 290/24mm vented unit made by DBA for an XR8 Falcon. Using as many OE parts as possible means there are no problems with low-cost spares supply in the future. Regular and high-performance brake pads, rebuild kits and rotors will be available almost forever. The hub is machined with the correct 'spigot' size to positively locate the centre of the wheel, a common (and technically illegal) omission with aftermarket brakes and a common reason for refusal at engineering/rego time. Unlike some aftermarket packages, there is no increase in track and the bearings and seals are standard VW. With more than double the pad area and a huge increase in heat-absorbing and heat-shedding ability, the braking effectiveness and fade resistance for super-quick street Beetles and Buggies (eg: WRX power, 1916cc, strokers, turbos etc etc) goes without saying. I have designed the package to fit inside 15-inch or larger Porsche or Ford wheels. Due to the calliper's size (double that of std ATE/Beetle), they will NOT fit inside widened VW wheels. My prototype runs a Ford stud pattern and Falcon AU 15x6-inch rims, which are a perfect fit under my standard guards. I chose these rims (and the Falcon PCD) for reasons of cost and popularity: Falcon wheels are piled up in wrecking yards, are cheap, and there is a huge range of factory and aftermarket wheels, too. EF-EL 'cop chaser' 15x6-inch rims (with less backspace) are an alternative for people who wish to 'fill out' widened guards, as are the later-model AUII-BA 16x7-inch steel rims. Of course, the Porsche stud pattern will also be available to those who wish to use or retain Porsche wheels. Note, too, that the conversion uses wheel studs - much more user-friendly than VW's original bolts! After I am happy with the front upgrade performance (currently testing with T3 rear drums) and master cylinder choice, this front brake upgrade will be tested with a disc rear for a super-effective street legal (all-new parts - no restudding) high-performance Beetle brake upgrade. [Edited on 30/3/2005 by VWCOOL] [Edited on 2/4/2005 by VWCOOL] [Edited on 7/6/2005 by VWCOOL]

gayanne Officially Full-On Dubber

307 posts · joined May 2004 · 7 Apr 2005, 4:54 pm

#331903

Ok Craig good questions,To get a caliper of the shelf will take some mods. Alternative braking and if not better would be a Porsche 944 setup or other and this is a proven product which is worth $1500 plus i would say this will consist of rotors calipers and still will need to check what size master cyl. and yes mods are needed.Craig i know what you are saying its affordable ,adaptable and their big they need to be tested at all extremes. P.s my braking system for my car cost $35oo with mods calipers,rotors,master cys. track stuff only stopping power unbelievable.JVLRacing

Peter Leonard Moderator Volatile

1,456 posts · joined Apr 2003 · 7 Apr 2005, 8:49 pm

#332055

Right... my body's listed on Ebay... aaaaany minute now...

q:duh y'all are doubting thomases. I gesticulate wildly in your general direction.

I'm interested in the brake package, because I've LOOKED at the pro stuff, and have found it wanting. I usually drive my car on the street, hardly ever in shopping malls, and even more rarely on the track.
Something to consider: the kind of racing/driving you're doing will determine what fluid you're running, what pad compound you're running, and neither of these extreme examples of specialisation are USEFUL ON THE STREET. Brakes, like engines have operating temperatures, and service lives, and intended uses.
Keep the info coming. Keep the raving to a minimum, and above all, please, please tell passing scientists about the bargains going on E-bay.😠

let sleeping dubs lie

fullnoise Fahrvergnugen

964 posts · joined Sep 2002 · 8 Apr 2005, 2:08 pm

#332532

Good on you for taking on this project GT.

The Hoodjaks are a good idea that's well engineered and I hope these brakes turn out the same. They're looking good so far.

When you get your 1916 you're welcome to give me a call for a brake comparison test. My car has the typical 1500 front calipers with type 3 rear drums.

Our cars would be the same weight and similar power but the tyre thing would take a bit of head scratching. If you can do porsche pattern I have 2 sets of Fuchs with good rubber that we could each use.

A pyro would also be a good idea to measure the brake temps.

My brakes are reaching their limits. The drums tend to warp and the rotors wear faster than the Bendix pads.

CYA* CT**

* Short for See You
** Not Craig Torrens

esratrams

56astro Custom Title Time!

1,772 posts · joined Aug 2002 · 8 Apr 2005, 9:52 pm

#332818

Peter Leonard wrote:Right... my body's listed on Ebay... aaaaany minute now...

q:duh y'all are doubting thomases. I gesticulate wildly in your general direction.

Keep the info coming. Keep the raving to a minimum, and above all, please, please tell passing scientists about the bargains going on E-bay.😠

LOL

If only you would use your talent for goodness, instead of evil.

Still waiting for that ride BTW

VW car, VW engine ...... keepin it "real"
35MPG on 101.3kPa

jakjones Officially Full-On Dubber

217 posts · joined Mar 2004 · 8 Apr 2005, 10:11 pm

#332834

So what size pistons are in those slider calipers ??
GT ?

Jak

tassupervee That really hurts doesnt it!

1,171 posts · joined Sep 2003 · 9 Apr 2005, 5:16 pm

#333104

I need to ask JVL a question.
Given your setup cost you 3 and a half grand, It would be fair to say that your setup is not exactly exotic, such as carbon rotors and calipers made from Unobtanium right?
I would guess, Iron rotors and Ally hats and calipers??
Perhaps something like EBC "green stuff" pads or similar?

Dont get me wrong dude, I am not running down your choice of brand/setup at all.
Im sure it works well for you and a legion of others.

So, if the pad material/areas and the disk areas/diameters are similar, and the master/slave cylinders relationship are similar enough, disk material is similar (iron) and a similar pedal effort.

Ignoring any fitting issues, why would a generic Brembo setup such as yours be any different/better to this dudes setup?

Secondly, what needs to be actually "proven"

I would think all these components are already been well and truly "proven" They have been designed, built and tested thoroughly under some pretty tough conditions to pass ADR's
Its quite amusing to see brakes on test, especially when the piston seals melt and the fluid sprays everywhere and catches fire on a yellow hot disk!

At the end of the day braking effort is only an equasion of the disk speed and radius, pad area and friction co-efficient and clamping force (loosely: pedal effort)
The wheels wont really care what the brand name is if both brake setups are similar enough. Racing or road.
Quite often the only difference between a "race" setup and a "road" setup is the pad compound.

I made my own disk brakes for one of my superkarts. The disks were made out of plain (no slots/crossdrilling/vents) Bisalloy 80.
The calipers were machined in 2 halves out of some thick ally plate of unknown spec ( I scavenged it).
These brakes are the same diameter as the really trick cross drilled and slotted superkart specific Kelgate cast iron/billet ally clobber on my F250E superkart (250cc twin cylinder). The very best stuff at the time.

My home made jobs are far superior, in every respects, to the million dollar brand name racing stuff, even using cruddy No-Name pads out of small motocross bikes.
The upshot is that the right "combination" of components was hit on and all parts of the system worked together to produce unbeatable power, feel and control.

There is NO reason in the world, that this dudes brakes will perform any less than the very best aftermarket clobber.
I submit that actually getting a decent set of pad hot enough, for long enough may be the issue!
IMHO, he seems to have researched and constructed his package well and at the end of the day, more than likely the only difference will be the brand name scratched on the side of the caliper.

L8tr
E

Im not a complete idiot, quite a few parts are missing....

gayanne Officially Full-On Dubber

307 posts · joined May 2004 · 10 Apr 2005, 10:56 am

#333426

Well tass, My brakes are not what you are discribing and $3500 for my set up is cheap for the quality of my braking which i got from CCI Racing Components which these items value are a lot more. Wilwood Alloy Superlites 4pots fronts with AP alloy hats with still twin ventilating rotors running Tan Carbon racing pads.Rears AP Lockheeds 2pots on custom made drilled disc supply fluid is 2 AP Tilton racing 3/4master cly. worth another $800. Like i said earlier Tass iam sure vwcool brakes will work fine for people who dont want to make mods fitting to there cars.Iam sure your brakes work fine but ill prefer to use my package over the rest and its a proven package that most professional racers would use in sportsedan etc.JVLRacing

[Edited on 10/4/2005 by gayanne]

tassupervee That really hurts doesnt it!

1,171 posts · joined Sep 2003 · 10 Apr 2005, 12:17 pm

#333462

Thats K dude, Im not casting aspersions on your system but I just cannot fathom why you seem to dismiss VWCools setup based on some ambiguous pix and a short written description thats all.

Its just that your comments smack a little of "if it doesnt have a brand name on the side then it cant be that wonderful"😎

Nothing more sinister than that.

L8tr M8
E

Im not a complete idiot, quite a few parts are missing....

gayanne Officially Full-On Dubber

307 posts · joined May 2004 · 10 Apr 2005, 1:08 pm

#333470

Tass my comments are not to bag vwcools brakes its about making people think before jumping into a pit before doing there homework and to prove the product ,get the star of approval then have a brand name so you are reconized.If you dont have a brand name how do people notice your product.I cant think to see how people can compare brakes to the likes of Alcon Brembos AP Wilwoods and Pbr even Porsche use the likes of these brands. P.s Good topic,Good debate.JVLRacing

malcolm Insano Dub Head

812 posts · joined Nov 2004 · 10 Apr 2005, 1:38 pm

#333472

a friend used the pbr brakes on a balljoint front end as vwcools and the ford eb caliper on the rear the car a porsche speedster rep finished in the top 10 at the dutton rally. you can also legally use AP calipers on a street car with any brake upgrade front to rear balance is always an issue. at extra cost I,ll be using a decel pedal box assembly to maximize balance and allows the user to use ifferent master cylinders .

malcolm Insano Dub Head

812 posts · joined Nov 2004 · 10 Apr 2005, 4:11 pm

#333522

how are you going to bias the front to rear , and are you going to get the complete assembly engineered and brake tested by a engineer because safty is the word. under hard conditions do the calipers expand causing pads to drop out .

tassupervee That really hurts doesnt it!

1,171 posts · joined Sep 2003 · 10 Apr 2005, 8:56 pm

#333712

gayanne wrote:Tass my comments are not to bag vwcools brakes its about making people think before jumping into a pit before doing there homework and to prove the product ,get the star of approval then have a brand name so you are reconized.If you dont have a brand name how do people notice your product.I cant think to see how people can compare brakes to the likes of Alcon Brembos AP Wilwoods and Pbr even Porsche use the likes of these brands. P.s Good topic,Good debate.JVLRacing

JVL
Dude, Im not suggesting at all that you have bagged VWC's clobber.
im just saying that you seem to have have dismissed his product based on lack of "being proved"
I dont understand? The products, as i have previously pointed out, are well and truly proven, on a far tougher and heavier testing ground that a relatively lightweight kraut.
I would submit that those components have been proven well in excess of your exotic stuff in a pre-production sense to gain ADR compliance on the vehicles they are currently on.
Of course, your stuff has been tested thoroughly in the field but what subjective pre-production testing has any of that stuff been subjected to as far as stringent ADR compliance.
I would say little, if not any at all. Id also go as far as to say that the development of that stuff is more an evolutionary thing based on feedback/destruction from race programmes with the benefit of regular stripdowns and inspection that that kind of hybrid lightweight "racing" clobber demands on a regular basis.

VWC's stuff is designed and tested under a extreme range of condition to their very destruction under controlled conditions in addition to feild testing, keeping in mind a long service life under little or in most cases, NO regular maintenance at all!
Again, if the various factors are similar, pad area and compound disk dia blah blah blah, the brakes will work equally as well as your brand name clobber.

I would go as far to suggest that VWC's equipment would comfortably match your clobber in overall performance and outlast your stuff to the magnitude of 5:1

There is NO real black art to ordinary brake design and construction at all. There are very few magical engineering techniques in the brakes we are debating that would set apart to ANY extent, your tricky name brand stuff to VWC's apart from sheer size and weight which would be a very important factor on any competitive race car.
There are no magical secrets in the centrifugal casting techniques of cast iron nor in the chemical makeup of the rotors.
The same goes for the hats and the calipers unless you are talking stuff such as the 12 opposed piston, one peice calipers made from unobtanium I have played with that are the stuff of the likes of F1, champcar blah blah! Those calipers cost thousands of dollars each (I forget exactly what now) but the cost was obscene. This kind of clobber is a long way out of our orbit!

Choose a diameter, an area, a material, a reasonably forseen weight of vehicle and working speed. Factor in clamping pressure and material of the pads and Voila! Brakes!
Equal in all operating respects apart from superior durability and most likely, slightly greater weight.

There is nothing to prove at all. It has already been done.
in this instance.

Your advantage with your 4 potters is possibly different leading and trailing piston sizes to equallise pad wear
Whether VWC's stuff uses this strategy I cannot say.

IMHO pay your money and take your choice.

L8tr
E

[Edited on 10/4/05 by tassupervee]

Im not a complete idiot, quite a few parts are missing....

tassupervee That really hurts doesnt it!

1,171 posts · joined Sep 2003 · 10 Apr 2005, 9:17 pm

#333740

malcolm wrote:under hard conditions do the calipers expand causing pads to drop out .

Errrrrrrr..ummmmmm...I.............

Sure, this is a common occurrence in late model Fords.
The owners handbook has a detailed description of how to put them back in after hard braking adventures!
You 7 yo son could replace them easily on the side of the road.....M8:P:P😘P:thumb:thumb:thumb😉😉😉😉😉😉😉😉😉😉😉😉😉:duh

L8tr
E

Im not a complete idiot, quite a few parts are missing....

gayanne Officially Full-On Dubber

307 posts · joined May 2004 · 10 Apr 2005, 10:20 pm

#333798

OK Tass now your rating vwcs brake set up to mind 5:1 you are joking,I think some home work is needed here mmmmm.Question wheres the balance in this system from front to back? What about sizes of master cyls,release of cyl.ratings after pedal push of after braking,do you use two cyls to compensate for ample flowing of fluid from front to rears ,all these technical egs need to be ask and you are telling me its all in the pads and all calipers work the same!mmmmJVLRacing

Che Castro ankle straps

1,945 posts · joined Aug 2002 · 11 Apr 2005, 12:15 am

#333881

Whats the advantage/disadvantage of a sliding single piston caliper (like the holden PBR one) over a twin piston opposing fixed caliper (like the stock ATE units)?

Jon

VWCOOL 23 Windows of Awesome

5,158 posts · joined Jun 2003 · 11 Apr 2005, 11:11 am

#334017

Holy fUkc! I go fishing for a few days and look what happens!

gayananne - these brakes are designed for my road car. They use all ADR-certified brake components from one of the worlds largest brake manufacturers PBR who supply OEs on every contenent on earth except Antarctica, where there are no car factories. The rotors are from DBA who although smaller and without the production volumes of PBR, do a sensational cast-iron disc. From the tone of your posts, it seems you are are a brand-name junkie with lots of stickers on his car....?

Me? I just want big, no-nonsense bolt-on brakes for my street Dubbie without the legal, enginering, legal, durability and expense and engineering and maintenance and fitment legal problems that aftermarket gear will give me. Using ALL OE ADR components as listed earlier in this thread give me that.... Read the posts - it's all there...

Ever seen a road car complied with comp-grade Wilwoods? No. Me neither. And that's for the reasons I outlind in earluer posts.

I fail to see why my brakes won't be a great upgrade for a Beetle used in comp such as sprints, hillclimbs and Targa events and that;s what I plan for my car. Plenty of Commodores, HSVs, Falcons and Tickfords in these events, I think you will agree...

You have failed to provide ANY reason why my brakes won't work in a comp car apart from the 'brand name'... Yet, there are MANY reasons why aftermarket callipers WON'T work for legal or durability reasons on the street. You really should read the instructions...

To Tassie, CT, Craig Torrens and others here.. thanks for the interest. Testing continues as soon as I get back from my top end fishing trip 😉

PS. I'm happy to provide a PBR sticker to anyone who is intersted... :P

[Edited on 11/4/2005 by VWCOOL]

Pay your debts, CxxT

gayanne Officially Full-On Dubber

307 posts · joined May 2004 · 11 Apr 2005, 1:46 pm

#334096

VWcool like i said for the last time,your brake set is ok ,not once have you told anybody about changing master cylinders to compensate for bigger brakes which they are,wheres the balance between front and back braking fluid travel ,ive givens enought egs you just cant put these calipers on and not think about this.Vwcool im not on here to knock your brakes but campariing your system with likes of my set up and other name brands mate thats a big call. P.S Saftey is my opinion.JVLRacing

Gracey Wolfsburg Wizard

511 posts · joined Feb 2003 · 11 Apr 2005, 5:06 pm

#334210

Gayanne, read the first page dude, Vwcool said he had to change to a kombi master cylinder not long after this thread started.

gayanne Officially Full-On Dubber

307 posts · joined May 2004 · 11 Apr 2005, 6:41 pm

#334302

Thanks Gracey i see,mmmmmKombi cyl 23mm to Beetle 19mm that covers fronts.JVLRacing

Craig Torrens 6 times Australian, 7 times State Hillclimb Class Champion

8,040 posts · joined Jan 2003 · 11 Apr 2005, 9:27 pm

#334437

gayanne wrote:VWcool like i said for the last time,your brake set is ok ,not once have you told anybody about changing master cylinders to compensate for bigger brakes which they are,wheres the balance between front and back braking fluid travel ,ive givens enought egs you just cant put these calipers on and not think about this.Vwcool im not on here to knock your brakes but campariing your system with likes of my set up and other name brands mate thats a big call. P.S Saftey is my opinion.JVLRacing

JVL when have your brakes been "race" tested ? Has your car actually made it to the track for a competitive race?

And all of VWcools components are "brands".

As gracey said..............go back and read.

Alex Holzl 2332cc of pure BALLZ!!

1,550 posts · joined Jan 2004 · 11 Apr 2005, 10:07 pm

#334470

:thumb

Che Castro ankle straps

1,945 posts · joined Aug 2002 · 11 Apr 2005, 10:46 pm

#334518

lol

Jon

malcolm Insano Dub Head

812 posts · joined Nov 2004 · 12 Apr 2005, 12:36 am

#334566

just because the brake components are adr,ed on another vehicle doesn,t mean they will pass brake testing and ie balance between front and back amount of force on brake pedal to stop car without locking up brakes it goe,s on and when a engineer road test the car he will also be testing all of these things and you wont be in the while he,s doing the test .SAFTY IS THE KEY on dry roads and wet.

malcolm Insano Dub Head

812 posts · joined Nov 2004 · 12 Apr 2005, 2:22 am

#334581

pad to piston size better to have larger piston to pad than large pad to piston do to small piston flexing pad and losing contact area.moving mass in a vw is in the rear porsche found this out an increased rear braking capacity.

gayanne Officially Full-On Dubber

307 posts · joined May 2004 · 12 Apr 2005, 7:51 am

#334606

Ok Craig my car has been to the track and brakes tested competitive and engineered to work to ther for potential for what they are designed for anything else Craig:P!mmmmJVLRacing

VWCOOL 23 Windows of Awesome

5,158 posts · joined Jun 2003 · 12 Apr 2005, 9:53 am

#334652

gayanne wrote:VWcool like i said for the last time,your brake set is ok ,not once have you told anybody about changing master cylinders to compensate for bigger brakes which they are,wheres the balance between front and back braking fluid travel ,ive givens enought egs you just cant put these calipers on and not think about this.Vwcool im not on here to knock your brakes but campariing your system with likes of my set up and other name brands mate thats a big call. P.S Saftey is my opinion.JVLRacing

lol... 'My set-up... other name brands'... what a laugh! You made the comparison between my brake components and your aftermarket track-only Wilwood stuff... I never mentioned it at all, yet for some obscure reason, you keep comparing your track-only, non-engineered, non-compliant system made up of at least two different brands to the system I have manufactured for my road-registered Beetle.

Master cylinder? Ummm.. Try reading the first page or two of this thread when I mentioned the master cylinder upgrade... As I have already mentioned in previous posts, one of the procedures I am undertaking while sorting out my front vented brake upgrade is to ensure that this system has correct front-rear brake bias. This is essential for the performance level I want and for Engineer Certificate (eg: when registering a WRX powered Beetle). Front/rear bias can only be validated by on-vehicle testing, although preliminary design/specs can of course be done by calculation or comparison.. which of course I have done. Many, many months ago... how else would I choose the components I have?!

Safety is your opinion... Umm, it's my priority and in the eyes of the law, what you have (wilwood) on your 'track' car is (I'll say it again...) NOT SUITABLE for road use. By using ADR certified components and with some decent engineering of brackets etc, there is absolutely no reason why my front brake upgrade won't pass Engineers Certificate/report for legal registration on a modified Beetle in all states of Australia.

There is no restudding of standard VW hubs;
There is no modification of the OE calliper;
There is no modification of OE calliper cradle/bracket;
The brake lines are unmodified standard OE;
Calliper mounting bolts are standard OE;
There is no heating/heat treatment/welding of any components;
There are no alloy components (such as hubs)
There is adequate clearance between calliper and wheels when using suggested unmodified Porsche or Falcon rims;
The calliper adapter brackets and hubs are one-piece items machined from steel with appropriate radii etc where appropriate and no heat treatment/welding issues (welded brake and steering components are technically illegal unless re-validated or certified with paperwork after testing);
The hubs are machined with a centre spigot (ADR requirement from 1973 - I think! - and often a reason for knock-back by engineers on modified cars);
The upgrade uses OE standard wheel studs..

All reasonably simple common sense really... I just follow the rules. These rules are far and away more stringent than any 'race car' stuff I have ever seen.

Gayanne, you claim you are not here to knock my brakes... well, you are already on record in this thread as saying (words to the effect of) they would not be suitable for a track car or competition... yet despite my bewilderment, you have failed to provide any technical, legal or any other reason why you reckon they are unsuitable...?

Hey, I don't mind opinion and feedback (yours and others) and am happy to answer any questions about what I am doing, but don't make claims that you can't substantiate.

Who 'tested' your mix of AP/Wilwood components? You? Or some other governing body? I might be wrong, but I wasn't aware there was any CAMS or ANDRA testing/certification procedure in place for competition brakes? (apart from simple pre-race scrutineering?)

Or does the word 'testing' to you simply mean the brakes stop the car at a track...?

As far as I am concerned, 'Testing' in my vented brake upgrade's case means the brakes must not only slow the car down, but must satisfy the intent and requirements of Section 3.3 (Brakes) of the NSW Code of Practice for Light Vehicle Modifications, including on-road testing to meet any performance requirement which is unable to be justified by other methods (such as continued compliance using previously ADR approved components).

There is no opportunity for me to seek 'type approval' for my brake upgrade so each installation is subject to an individual Engineers Certificate, as is any other 'major' (non owner-certifiable) modification to a Beetle such as engine transplant, different seats etc. To allow the possibility of these upgraded brakes being Engineer-approved on other Beetles, it is my intention to test the performance of my brakes to ensure there will be no reason (such as incorrect bias or badly-machined components) for these vented brakes to be 'knocked back' by a Consulting Engineer.

If on-raod testing shows that I have to, I will re-assess and revise the specifications of master cylinder, proportioning valves etc etc to achieve my desired outcome which is, as required by the CoP, consistent brake balance and performance exceeding that of similar unmodified cars (open to interpetation by the individual Engineer, but with V8 brakes, I think I'll be right!!!) and with the fronts locking before the rears.

Gayanne, do your brakes satisfy the intent and requirements of the NSW CoP?

Just for fun 😉I also intend to perform what some car manufacturers call the 'Alpine Descent Test' or 'Abuse test' which is a measure of fade resistance involving full-throttle acceleration and braking from 100km/h to zero several times. Most brand-new cars can do this three or four times before a considerable degradation in braking performance, and an increase in braking distance, occurs. For 'customer satisfaction' reasons, HSV, FPV Porsche etc aim for 10 or more cycles before fade is noticeable... I have 'killed' the brakes on a Porsche Cayenne Turbo on both road (Thredbo to Tom Groggin, NSW Snowy Mountains - steepest road in the country, I think!) and track (Oran Park Nth) so it's safe to say that no braking system is totally hoon-proof!

All my 'Name Brand' PBR and DBA components have been tested and proven to destruction by thier manufacturers and because I am using them in unmodified form, those OE testing and durability/validation procedures remain relevant for my upgrade as far as an Engineer's Certificate is concerned. Try doing that with Woodwillies... lol

Keep in mind, the front brake callipers I am using were designed for a 5.7-litre Chevrolet Corvette before being adopted by Holden for the 1986 VL Turbo and V8 Commodore. Like the rotors that I have used , they are 100 percent legal, ADR-compliant OE fitment in Oz and have been tested for a long and trouble-free design life.

As explained earlier in this thread, after I have played with my vented front upgrade teamed with T3 rear drums, they will be mated to a modified Falcon rear disc assembly... engineered by the same company (PBR) to the same internationally-recognised standards for durability and performance.

Gayanne - or anyone else - unless you can provide ADR-recognised paperwork to the contrary, I will stand behind my assertion that Wilwoods are NOT designed to these high standards. The lack of durable componentry (as evidenced by the express instructions to inspect/rebuild after use) and FOR OFF-ROAD USE ONLY on the box is a hint...

Happy to discuss further.. now it's back to the testing!!

[Edited on 12/4/2005 by VWCOOL]

[Edited on 12/4/2005 by VWCOOL]

Pay your debts, CxxT

VWCOOL 23 Windows of Awesome

5,158 posts · joined Jun 2003 · 12 Apr 2005, 10:17 am

#334659

jakjones wrote:So what size pistons are in those slider calipers ??
GT ?

Jak

54mm

Pay your debts, CxxT

VWCOOL 23 Windows of Awesome

5,158 posts · joined Jun 2003 · 12 Apr 2005, 10:32 am

#334667

malcolm wrote:just because the brake components are adr,ed on another vehicle doesn,t mean they will pass brake testing and ie balance between front and back amount of force on brake pedal to stop car without locking up brakes it goe,s on and when a engineer road test the car he will also be testing all of these things and you wont be in the while he,s doing the test .SAFTY IS THE KEY on dry roads and wet.

yep, you are right... but using unmodified ADR-compliant components (ie: wrecking yard parts!) makes it possible for the vented upgraded brake package to be considered for legal registration as part of a Modified Vehicle engineering evaluation. Engineering certification usually includes an on-road evaluation of an upgraded braking system's performance so no matter what the parts are from (Daewoo to Daimler) the Engineer can be satisfied everythig works in a safe and acceptable manner. By choosing components that all 'roughly' match each other (master cylinder, front and rear piston diameters) I am confident my brakes will all 'work' without any problems. I can also add a proportioning valve if testing deems it necessary

As I have mentioned several times in this thread, I am testing these brakes on my own car so that I can be sure my upgrade will a) cause retina damage when you hit the brake pedal and b) satisfy an engineer. All simple procedure, really...
:thumb

[Edited on 12/4/2005 by VWCOOL]

[Edited on 12/4/2005 by VWCOOL]

Pay your debts, CxxT

Doug Sweetman Nil Bastardo Carborundum

2,128 posts · joined Sep 2002 · 12 Apr 2005, 1:42 pm

#334747

Mate, if (hopefully when) I had the $$ required I would jump at your kit on the front, XF - EB kit on the back and bigger master cylinder. That would stop anything that I would ever want to put in my car.

Will this setup work with an L bug macpherson front ? or is that setup different ?

VWCOOL 23 Windows of Awesome

5,158 posts · joined Jun 2003 · 12 Apr 2005, 2:17 pm

#334767

Doug Sweetman wrote:Mate, if (hopefully when) I had the $$ required I would jump at your kit on the front, XF - EB kit on the back and bigger master cylinder. That would stop anything that I would ever want to put in my car.

Will this setup work with an L bug macpherson front ? or is that setup different ?

If the demand is there, I will look at helping-out 'silly' 😉 Super owners who have too much go! Supers might be able to use the same bracket and stuff... Maybe it might just be a one-off machining operation of the strut with a new bracket using my standard hub and rotor... are the bearings the same? I'm not sure cos I haven't had a look!! I'm still working out things on my own car!!
[Edited on 13/4/2005 by VWCOOL]

[Edited on 13/4/2005 by VWCOOL]

Pay your debts, CxxT