Dangerous if you get stuck for bends and stuff I can organise something from CES if you want. Trevor would be happy to help if you need it.
ACCEPT THAT SOME DAYS YOU ARE THE PIDGEON AND SOME DAYS YOU ARE THE STATUE
Alder Outlaws VW Racing - check it out on fb!!
Nice concreting job dave. How did you go for getting power organized?
Still waiting on Energex.
westi wrote:That's mad Alan.
Man I must have nodded off in that part of tech drawing.....or to quote the wise one, Homer Simpson.
"every time I learn something new, it pushes out something old"
Well easier said than done.
After making the four quarters of the collector,
I welded them up with the oxy.
Not totally happy, but it will work for my first time.
westi wrote:That's mad Alan.
Quick tidy up and some HPC coating and they'll look every part of a professional job!!!!
ACCEPT THAT SOME DAYS YOU ARE THE PIDGEON AND SOME DAYS YOU ARE THE STATUE
Alder Outlaws VW Racing - check it out on fb!!
After completeing the collector and mounting it TEMPORARILY where it needs to be,
I can begin to fill in the gaps.
I have completed the ONE and THREE cylinders, and will go to the next cylinder tomorrow.
I borrowed a small tig welder to do the remaining parts, but still need more practice.
I think they will clean up OK and at least I can control the penetration
and make sure there are no dilburies hanging inside the pipes.
I have been able to reduce the pipe length by about 10",
which is not as short as I would have liked but still much better.
westi wrote:That's mad Alan.
LIFE IN THE LOW LANE wrote:Quick tidy up and some HPC coating and they'll look every part of a professional job!!!!
No HPC coating for me.
A can of black exhaust paint is all it needs,
and not a waste of food money on shiney stuff.
I prefer ACTUAL performance improvements rather than imaginary ones.
But yes, the stuff is pretty.
Here you can see where the collector is mounted to get the length where I want it.
You can see in this shot, how far back the collector used to be.
westi wrote:That's mad Alan.
Damn Dave..... Thats lookin' so nice!..... And Im happy for you and the floor.... It always amazed me how you did what you did with the bluemetal you had happening B4 (Prior 😉)
PS.... I'd still love to grab that tube car off you.... Maybe I'll have a chat with you at Warwick if I make it over..... Gotta save the pennys for the trip..... Still need to sort a place to stay!
humpty wrote:Damn Dave..... Thats lookin' so nice!..... And Im happy for you and the floor.... It always amazed me how you did what you did with the bluemetal you had happening B4 (Prior 😉)
PS.... I'd still love to grab that tube car off you.... Maybe I'll have a chat with you at Warwick if I make it over..... Gotta save the pennys for the trip..... Still need to sort a place to stay!
Perhaps we can do a tube car accomodation deal for Warwick?
Do you think B4 might come up for a look this year?
westi wrote:That's mad Alan.
I think Aaron is thinking about it.... I'll give Dave a call and try to talk him into it.... He's dragged that bus into the shed just lately..... Seems he's got a interest back!
Looking good Dave.
What program are you using?
What size is your collector going to be?
http://www.maxracesoftware.com/pipemax36xp2.htm
Program is called Pipemax.
Collector will be just over 3" OD tube.
Not sure if I will make a megaphone or not.
If so, 2.5 to 3.5" diameter, and 15" length.
Around 15" seems to be the spot.
[ Edited on 17-5-2007 by dangerous ]
westi wrote:That's mad Alan.
Interesting stuff.
It'll be interesting to see how it performs.
Thanks Dave.
Wow! What a chore.
Rule 1 : Don't use a TIG when it is windy!
Enough excuses, its almost done.
Just have to make a tail pipe, and then tidy all the welds up for paint.
There is so much to learn with this TIG welding.
Buy the time I got to the last weld, I almost had the welder sussed out.
I will have to re-fit the wheely bars to make sure the position of the stinger/tailpipe clears.
I am going to try to make a tapered pipe from 2.5" up to 3.5" over a 15" length.
Not quite sure HOW yet, but that is the next step.
If not a straight piece or 3" tube will do the trick.
[ Edited on 19-5-2007 by dangerous ]
westi wrote:That's mad Alan.
Looks neat....screams out for a big stinger. Will it fit under a rear apron now?
I could have a go at rolling one for you Dave.... I have rollers at work that I have been thinking of trying that on.....
Yes, it will all fit under the apron now Andrew.
Even if it makes no more power, it will at least have reached one goal.
Thanks Simon, I also have a set of small rollers that I made at Tech college,
so I will try them first.
Just not sure how much taper I can get as yet.
I did make a small stinger many years ago, but it has been lost in translation.
I may take you up on that offer!
westi wrote:That's mad Alan.
dangerous wrote:LIFE IN THE LOW LANE wrote:Quick tidy up and some HPC coating and they'll look every part of a professional job!!!!
No HPC coating for me.
A can of black exhaust paint is all it needs,
and not a waste of food money on shiney stuff.
I prefer ACTUAL performance improvements rather than imaginary ones.
But yes, the stuff is pretty.
Here you can see where the collector is mounted to get the length where I want it.
You can see in this shot, how far back the collector used to be.
True mate you need to save for the ingredients of all the muffins you have to make for the busy part of the year as far as racing is concerned....
ACCEPT THAT SOME DAYS YOU ARE THE PIDGEON AND SOME DAYS YOU ARE THE STATUE
Alder Outlaws VW Racing - check it out on fb!!
maybe you could have a stall at Warwick.
"Will swap muffins for methonol"
westi's how to helped you out.good to see people having a go.
pretty good for you first time.
as for your tig,what temps were you welding with.what size filler rod did you use .how fine did you sharpen the electrod.i might be able to give you some tips.
down sharon.
Hi Westi,
Thanks for the encouragement, depite the ugly work.
I am using 1.6 wire and 1.6 tip, and it is pretty pointy...like about ..say..3 degrees incuded angle.
Way sharper than a pencil.
The most trouble was the wind, but also some bubbles when I welded the 10mm thick flange
to the 1.6mm wall tube(or thinner on the outside of a bend).
The last one of four worked OK with a fair bit MORE heat in the weld(75 on the scale where as it was about 45 on the tubes).
I am using pure argon, so this may be an issue too?
It is all done now(4 fun filled days!), but I can see me doing all this again in my future!
[ Edited on 23-5-2007 by dangerous ]
westi wrote:That's mad Alan.
Well it has been a while so here is the finished exhaust.
There were three factors in the poor welding technique.
Wind,
Not enough amps on thick material,
and not enough argon flow.
Oncethese things were solved it all worked sweet, shame it was in the end.
The stinger rolled up OK,
but the rollers were at their limit of angularity to get a 1" taper over 15".
I had to use a V8 style flange to get the diameter correct.
westi wrote:That's mad Alan.
Fantastic work there.Good to see I'm not the only one who masters the tools when the jobs nearly finished.Just had to make another set of ally fuel rails because I didn't master the TIG straight away.
Well I certainly would not say I have mastered it,
but I did get the pipes to join, and they did not fall off the car last night.
It sounds great, and even idles different...who would have thought!?
Unfortunately I prefer performance , and it was sadly lacking in that department.
I was a bit sad last night on the way home because the results were not as good as I had hoped.
11.66@114.13(felt lean)
11.67@114.68(richened it up down low, (probably too much since that was the only pill-step i had for below sea level conditions) It felt better, but time cards dont lie)
11.48@116.34(took fuel out of mixture above 7000, much better)
11.70@115.77(lazy launch)
11.69@115.59(clutch slipped about a car length out, then wheel stood)
The night was very cold and it caught me out a bit with the fuel system.
As above, the last run showed clutch slip, so I will have to service that.
That is now 45 runs on this engine so I think it is time to upgrade.
I have the Dyno day on at the end of July so I will at least have to sus out the clutch before then, and then retire this combo afterwards.
I think at this stage that the smaller exhaust tubing did increase the torque down low,
but it has lost about 10hp overall on this combo.
With finer fuel system tuning I could get it to be equal,
but unless I can get those primary lengths down to the optimum of 26 to 30"(currently 34) I will have to go back to 2" plus tubes.
Thanks to Pete, Rod for the snakes (and the energy pep that they gave),
Stanley, Col, and Andrew(13BVW) for coming out in the cold for support!
[ Edited on 27-6-2007 by dangerous ]
[ Edited on 28-6-2007 by dangerous ]
westi wrote:That's mad Alan.
dangerous wrote:That is now 45 runs on this engine so I think it is time to upgrade.
I have the Dyno day on at the end of July so I will at least have to sus out the clutch before then, and then retire this combo afterwards.
!
[ Edited on 27-6-2007 by dangerous ]
Maybe it's time to go back to some forced induction....:P
It did sound great. All that work was worth it just for the sound....:thumb
No way!
The back up engine is assembled and waiting.
More compression, more lift and better heads.
Lighter(non-blower) components also.
westi wrote:That's mad Alan.
Good Stuff Dave even if you are sad.
It shows us how a lot of hard work and cash sometimes doesn't work, and we feel like shit.
BUT when it does we seem to forget all about it. We always learn and I think if there was more track time and hotter conditions we would see a better result. People like you help everyone else with their R&D because you have done it.
I think this system will work better on the new engine. Am I correct??
VOLLKOMMEN ART
nick@vollkommenart.com
Speed and Style
out of interest how did you measure them.
they only look short to me.
and a good rule of thumb is short and fat,long and skinny
nice work ,keep the pic's comin
down sharon.
The program I am using asks the length to start from the flange rather than the valve seat.
(It asks for the port length as one of the inputs, and factors it in).
The end of the pipe is one inch after the primary breaks into the collector,
"half way along the cone" as Larry Meaux quoted.
The pipes are 34" using this method, and one is a little shorter than this(#2)
This exhaust may work better on the other combo,
but I was hoping this would be the case on this one too.
Thanks for the pep up Nick.
That is an interesting rule of thumb Westi.
Isn't that about something else?:blush
I have been thinking more along the lines of short and thin or long and fat
when it comes to exhausts.
westi wrote:That's mad Alan.
