all it comes down to at the end is this........... want to make big hp for low cost stick with what u know if you want to save fuel stay standard no 48 ida for u on ya boxer, as for the old ej20t another great motor how ever it takes a shit load more money to rebuild it if something brakes if i spend 10,000 on a vw motor uld want it to be 200hp+ spend the same on a rotor and your in a car with one hell of a ride with 400+ id rather replace a couple of seals then replace a stroker crank big pistons and barrels those expencive ported and polished heads and maybe even a conrod threw the case can get quite expensive for my next i will use the old vw t1 boxer cause going fast is not what i want or the big fuel bill like to hear from u ...🤪
gas research do a lpg conversion for rotary's and how cool would a stainless gas tank look under the bonet might help with weight distribution aswell....lpg is about 40c a litre and is pretty clean and yes rotaries dont really have any problems these days.. no more than any other engine... its the old story the harder you drive anything the quicker it breaks, I had a 12a turbo cosmo recently and i couldnt break it.
it was good for 210kph before the limiter kicked in.
just FYI 210kph on the dyno Mr plod...................
HONEST......
Ahh. I hate and LOVE this topic.
It would be a simple conversion, really, appart from the cooling.
the adapter kit, fuel system (fuel pump, fuel pressure reg and carbie/manifold) would be easy.
Cooling/ eningine mounts are the hard part. i personaly really dislike holes in bonnets for cooling. oil cooling is also a huge part, and that is also quite hard.
the positive is that rota's rev a crap load. and sound sick. but can you get out of it for less than what you would spend on a comparitve air cooled engine. I could build a decent 1916 with carbies for under $5000.... but i couldnt get a carbie -N/A rota in for for that.
Its a sweet idea.... but you've gotta really love them. I hope to do it one day, if i have $10 000 to throw at an engine and transmission, id do it.
🙂
i stil run the same 1500 swing axle transmision from when the the conversion was done maybe 4 years ago and never a problem as for oil cooling its all about hit and miss mine runs fine if you live in sydney melbourne brisbane cooling is nothing its all about sealing and ducting as for cornering perfect big sway bars front and back its like anything you have to want to do it ........... as for the 1916 thing ill eat it for lunch for a min amount .......... $2500 verse $9000 i like it like that save the money people are just scared of hybrid things such as this......... if you need to know any tips let me know
p.s mine is up for sale
my beast
Mt rotary cost me $800 fits just as well as the orig air cooled motor and has 3 times the power and better economy (as long as its not getting floored) than my old 1835. The gearbox breakages suck but thats probably the wheelstands,( I broke two boxes with the 1835 aswell).
13BVW 11.80@114mph
bugzla wrote:my beast
See, I love your car, except i cant stand that the front has holes cut out.... But thats the only thing... A rotary would make a MEGA sweet sleeper, heck, i guess any large bore boxer would.. but rotarys just rev like anything. the renisis will just pull to 9500rpm in each gear... the rx8 has shown us that.
How is your oil cooled ... is there a cooler at the front? I like the idea that 'westi' has on his car, where the gearbox is cooled with an oil cooler, do you think this would be possible to do with a radiator or two. I have seen bugs with the radiator where the backseat goes.
you don't have to cut holes in the front apron. you can scoop air into the bottom of the spare wheel well while leaving the front in tact.
bugzla wrote:........... as for the 1916 thing ill eat it for lunch for a min amount .......... $2500 verse $9000 i like it like that save the money people are just scared of hybrid things such as this......... if you need to know any tips let me know
p.s mine is up for sale
Haha...thats funny!! My 1916 absolutely toasted my mated 13B injected engine....
Both were in Manx buggies as well..same tyres etc etc...
tssnq.com.au
MickH wrote:bugzla wrote:........... as for the 1916 thing ill eat it for lunch for a min amount .......... $2500 verse $9000 i like it like that save the money people are just scared of hybrid things such as this......... if you need to know any tips let me know
p.s mine is up for sale
Haha...thats funny!! My 1916 absolutely toasted my mated 13B injected engine....
Both were in Manx buggies as well..same tyres etc etc...
😂😂 Go you good thing
Matt Berry Motorsports...air cooled advice, repairs and mods Ph 0408 704 662
OFF-ROAD,CIRCUIT,DRAG,STREET,ENDURANCE
from memory that 1916 was also running nos i think you said bit of a unfair comparison mick 🤪
plus did he launch hard and use all of the 7000 rpm from standard right through all gears,
i find if i launch hard its all good how ever if its a normal take off it aint so good as wat has been said before not to much torque down low with the rota but look at the money again ....................................😊
Hi all, Just my 2 cents worth, I would use a 12A turbo
in a beetle because they are quite powerfull and getting very cheep. I etimate the hole conversion to be around $3500 including 12a rebuild, thats DIY.
AARON'S SPEED SHIFT AUTOS
Specialising in Vw automatic transmissions, differentials and torque converters
Stock or modified to suit your application (street, drag, off road)
Ph 0402 233 027
And the lurker shows his hand.....knew this thread would bring you out of the closet A. Welcome
Matt Berry Motorsports...air cooled advice, repairs and mods Ph 0408 704 662
OFF-ROAD,CIRCUIT,DRAG,STREET,ENDURANCE
Hi
Wow we have learner dubber on here now, welcome along Aaron. Your forum a virgin but a 1/4 mile @#$$&^$%^, please insert your own definition, or otherwise known as a 1/4 mile person of loose morals.
Steve
bugzla wrote:from memory that 1916 was also running nos i think you said bit of a unfair comparison mick 🤪
plus did he launch hard and use all of the 7000 rpm from standard right through all gears,
i find if i launch hard its all good how ever if its a normal take off it aint so good as wat has been said before not to much torque down low with the rota but look at the money again ....................................😊
NOS was only on the 1500....
The 1916 was 102HP at the wheels, little down in the EJ engine I have now.....didn't Marks "bathtub" kick yer arse with the EJ LOL
😂😂 In all fairness he wizzed past me after I got to 130Kmh.....in 2nd gear i might add....screaming it's titz off...
🤓 Damn Wankels...
tssnq.com.au
Thanks for the welcome.
What are you doing in this dark little corner of the forum???
Looking for ideas for Warwick are we😵
AARON'S SPEED SHIFT AUTOS
Specialising in Vw automatic transmissions, differentials and torque converters
Stock or modified to suit your application (street, drag, off road)
Ph 0402 233 027
at that stage it was with no linkage bars and was flopping around like crazy so i couldnt give it a good hit he would had still beat me power to weight,
mine was still cheaper for a little less power ........... it was the best set out buggies ive seen great bar work and strengthing awsome what can i say ................... yours is great to thou mick ..........😘 but u do have more ks on the clock too both are a great conversion very tidy and perpose built.
Howdy 20bkombi seen ur car a couple of times love it
Mines a little different now.....hehe...
tssnq.com.au
Firstly, I am not against a water cooled beetle. But can you guys tell me the best simplest place to run the water pipes. So that the average bloke could do them and not a metal fabricator. And be has to pass engineer.
Also, I personally dont like the vents/grill cut into the bonnet. I know others have put radiators up front without doing this, do you have any details photos. This may also help others make the decision to go water cooled.
Thanks for your help, Kevin
I thought rebuilding a VW would be cheap - Shit I was wrong, just don't let the wife know !!!!
Click here for my (slowy) modded 1961 Beetle build.camo you want need to cut vents in the bonnet if you in sydney mine was fine u just need to create a scope behind the bumper seal the radiator in and thats it make sure the radiator is flush with the petrol tank and sealed as well its all about sealing the radiator so that the air goes only throght the radiator not around it .............. pics i dont have sorry
Yeah I know not a beetle, but you can do somthing similar.
These pics were when i was striping the car for paint, i think 2003, so i didn't have the top fan cover on.
The fans blow the hot air under the fuel tank, witch has a thick insulation foam with aluminum on the out side.
As for the water pipes i use 38mm x 1.6 thick under the pan straight along either side of the tunnel and use hoses for the bends.
I will try to take some pics of then soon.
The cut outs under the bumper are enough for the twin turbo rotary wich puts out 198 rear wheel hp on 7 psi, no intercooler.
So i think a 12 turbo or 13b 6port would keep just as cool in a beetle.
Like mentioned earler sealing is the key
AARON'S SPEED SHIFT AUTOS
Specialising in Vw automatic transmissions, differentials and torque converters
Stock or modified to suit your application (street, drag, off road)
Ph 0402 233 027
2003
AARON'S SPEED SHIFT AUTOS
Specialising in Vw automatic transmissions, differentials and torque converters
Stock or modified to suit your application (street, drag, off road)
Ph 0402 233 027
pending on the car the oil cooler placement is critical try and find a place with constant air flow and u should be right ............................ 😂
This subject always grabs my interest.
Is it possible to run the oil cooler to the front of the car, or the oil lines far too long for this. I cant imagine most people would want to have to buy 10 litres of oil just for a change. 🙂
as for cooling pipes can they run any lower than the pan, or must they be above the lowest part of the pan... ie inside the tunnel, or similar.
Camo wrote:Firstly, I am not against a water cooled beetle. But can you guys tell me the best simplest place to run the water pipes. So that the average bloke could do them and not a metal fabricator. And be has to pass engineer.
Also, I personally dont like the vents/grill cut into the bonnet. I know others have put radiators up front without doing this, do you have any details photos. This may also help others make the decision to go water cooled.
Thanks for your help, Kevin
Kev, you dont get much more simple than my old rotary bug had for water lines
just 2 lengths of zorst pipe with hose clamps around them every 500mm or so that were tucked under those funky square washers along each sill that hold the heater channels to the floor pans
crude but it worked from the late 80s up till i bought it in 2001
i agree tho, vents in the hood spoil the look and also give the game away
my bug just had holes in the valance i put mesh in them but after i painted it .
with the mesh painted black and a bumper on you wouldnt even notice
with my Lbug conversion i plan on getting a US front valance which has the factory A/C grille under the bumper
I'd go with a 13b 6port in my 71 superbeetle. I had a 6 port in my 77 808 wagon, and that thing was absolutely mental! I had a Microtech MT-4 running the mapping, and it hauled some serious ass. I can only imagine how much it would haul in a beetle, which would be lighter!
As everyone has said, oil cooler placement and radiator is critical. the oil cooler from a Series 3 rx7 will do! Nice and big (Just gotta fit it somewhere). The radiator, well we can do many things there. Water injection could also help lower the temperature. I've thought about locating a custom fuel cell/tank under the rear seats and using the space under the front to place a shroud to a radiator, and even have twin thermos working as well, however I don't want to cut into the bonnet. Still nutting that one out...dun wanna spoil the look I'm after.
I quoted up a kit to get a rota engine in the beetle, getting a conversion kit from a bloke in QLD, and if my memory serves me well, it was under $900. My concern (as it was in the 808 as well) is braking power!
That beetle above has used the front apron very well!
I'd be happy to give some advice on rotary engines....used to be an absolute fanatic! Yes they can be thirsty, yes they have quirks, but once those rotas get up into the rev range, it's a rush I cannot explain!
Kind Regards
Zako
I'm looking at this whole rotary idea in a racecar shortly.... but I'm still hesitant on making a decision to use a VW transaxle, simply because of the horror stories I'm hearing about breaking trannies..... I'm leaning towards a Renault UN-1 transmission now.
There's alot of talk about the motors and how powerful they are, but little in regards to getting it reliably to the ground....
Anyone care to comment?
Most of the comments on rotaries being unreliable stem from when they were first used in the 60's. The rotary in mine has been a hell of a lot more reliable than the VW motors it replaced.
The guys from Marrineli's automotive/mechanical in Ipswich run a circuit anglia with a rotary and when I asked them about theirs they said they get it freshened once a year.
13BVW 11.80@114mph
