2443 Twin turbo street bug project, back on track again.

2443TT · 2007-11-17T12:39:46+00:00

Hi Everybody, Well my 1966 bug has been off the road for more than a year now. What started out as some mild engine changes and a gearbox upgrade (that never eventuated), has turned into a complete rebuild of the car. I've now got the car stripped of its guards, suspension removed, Porsche brakes are gone etc. All that remains is the shell and its sitting on stands. The reason all this happened is that after a few conversations with Rod Penrose, I discovered I needed to change a lot more things to improve the reliability of my setup if I wanted to extract very serious HP from it for any extended period of time. This meant some serious engine changes... which then got a little out of control. The end result of all the parts chasing, machining and custom made parts will be a 2443cc twin turbo'd, twin intercooled engine, water cooled heads, setup for sub 7:1 compression, flanged crank, 4 stage dry sump system, twin plate clutch, around 8500 rpm and potential for about 400-500rwhp. The engine build is on hold till the last of the machining work is finished and will be posted on another thread when it kicks into full swing. Having that much power meant that using a vw gearbox was going to be pretty pointless. I'd been previously trying to source a custom built box from Rancho. That was for the 2332 engine, but as it turned out I would have probably broken that box inside a year anyway. So the only option was to go porsche. 915 boxes are good for about 300hp, or more if you spend money on them. The g50's are massive, and require an absurd amount of cutting away of the chassis from what I've seen of other people cars. Unless I were to go 1/2 or full tube frame chassis, G50 was off the cards. I did come very close to getting a G50 though, and found a 2wd converted 5 speed for $4300 in sydney. But as it turns out Dave Butler had a 930 box. It didnt take much to persuade him to sell it either. These boxes are used in the Ultima GTO's with 500hp small block V8's on them. In stock form they handle 550hp, and with an oil cooler and remote oil pump they are basically the same box used in the 750hp 935 race cars. At last an indestructable gearbox. THe down side is that the ratio's are very high, but that can be fixed with a ratio change down the track. Now with an engine and gearbox sorted, I needed a way to get the power to the ground. It had been my plan to widen the guards and put some very serious rubber under the car. I've had the car that looks stock that goes like a rocket. Now Im going all out, the outward appearance is going to have to have as much intimidation factor as the engine sound will have. To make all this possible I was going to have to completely re-work the suspension on the existing chassis, or just build a new one and start from scratch. I scored a swing axel chassis to use as a donor pan and went about cutting and clearancing for the gearbox. So for suspension I've sourced all 1988 944 Turbo components. These are the widest rear trailing arms made for the 944's and increase the wheel track by around 100mm with the wheels I will be using. The front suspension is going to be converted to a custom Mcpherson strut arrangement using 944 turbo A-Arms, and spindles etc. All the suspension is going to be fully adjustable, so I can set the car up for motokhana or drags. I want the car to handle, stop and go. Anyway enough background... I've spend a few weekends contemplating how to best attack the new chassis and today I started to get serious with it. 930 Gearbox Clearancing My unique approach to an IRS conversion. Front gearbox mount/crossmember, and front torsion housing re-inforcing (the cardboard template). So thats about all for now. I hope to finish the front gearbox mount tomorrow. Im going to try and make regular posts for this build. The goal is to have it finished in 5 months. Cheers, Ian Swinkels

VWFREAK VWFREAK

2,577 posts · joined May 2004 · 9 Mar 2009, 5:31 pm

#699546

Looking good Ian. 👍

2443TT Fahrvergnugen

962 posts · joined Dec 2002 · 9 Mar 2009, 5:54 pm

#699551

Im considering the davies craig electric water pumps at the moment, combined with thermostats for the oil and water cooling systems. Ive got a nice moon eyes over flow tank to use as a filler for the system, and it will work as a swirl pot as well.

Ive drawn the diagram up quite a few times now but until the car is a little more assembled I cant really finalise the setup until I start mounting components in it. So radiators and oil coolers get mounted next, then the plumbing, thermostat and pump mounting will happen.

Turbo54 Veteran Volks Folk

2,220 posts · joined Jul 2004 · 10 Mar 2009, 12:48 pm

#699760

Ian, let me know which pump you go for. i am looking for a pump to run my cooling system. Looking great.
T54

C'mon kids gather round,
there's a new sensation hitting town,
It's moving straight, low to the ground,
it'll pick you up when your feeling down.

Boostn Wolfsburg Wizard

657 posts · joined Apr 2005 · 10 Mar 2009, 3:32 pm

#699784

SHIT loads of work done Ian. I can't believe how much this poor little bug has changed.
I thought when it was silver you wanted to go drag racing, but it looks to me like a circuit racer with wide stance.

VOLLKOMMEN ART
nick@vollkommenart.com

Speed and Style

2443TT Fahrvergnugen

962 posts · joined Dec 2002 · 10 Mar 2009, 6:35 pm

#699834

Boostn wrote:SHIT loads of work done Ian. I can't believe how much this poor little bug has changed.
I thought when it was silver you wanted to go drag racing, but it looks to me like a circuit racer with wide stance.

Yeah well the whole idea of this rebuild was to take it to the other extreme. It would have pased for a stockish beetle when it was silver, except for the porsche wheels and the engine note. But it was just too unstable at speed 1/2 to do with suspension and the rest to do with aerodynamics I suspect. Id like the car to feel stable at 120mph, not like its going to get airbourne any second.

And yes while i do want to drag race the car, it will see far more motorkarna events than drag strips so the focus is more on handling than straight line speed.

Smiley Veteran Volks Folk

2,125 posts · joined Oct 2008 · 6 Apr 2009, 8:46 pm

#705494

Any news on the car Ian?

If you said I was a Volkswagen man, you'd be right.

Golde60 Fahrvergnugen

858 posts · joined Aug 2002 · 6 Apr 2009, 11:08 pm

#705565

I think I speak for smileyman and everyone else on forum when I say

I NEED A FIX MAAAAAAN!

Been about a month and I m gonna find a new dealer if you dont hook me up soon

...................( O \ l / O ).....................

Mick058 Custom Title Time!

1,580 posts · joined Jan 2008 · 7 Apr 2009, 8:30 am

#705619

agreed! My fav build thread is missed.

http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=67295 (myride)

Romans 10:9

Smiley Veteran Volks Folk

2,125 posts · joined Oct 2008 · 11 Apr 2009, 2:54 pm

#706405

I'm getting the shakes! 😂

If you said I was a Volkswagen man, you'd be right.

trickysimon 100km/h is only 9 seconds away

1,473 posts · joined Dec 2007 · 11 Apr 2009, 2:58 pm

#706406

Stop posting on here smileyman3000, everytime I see this thread at the top of the list I feel like a kid on Christmas day, only to find there is no presents 😂
(Just kidding smiley😉)

2443TT Fahrvergnugen

962 posts · joined Dec 2002 · 11 Apr 2009, 7:39 pm

#706470

Sorry to say there isnt any news. Im still waiting on my cylinder heads from DRD. They are now 2 months overdue which is beginning to be a little concern. They havent given me an ETA either. I am hoping they havent gone bankrupt or something. Especially since I had to pay 50% up front.

The last email Darren said he was the only one working in his shop, and they would have some time next month to work on them. Had I known they would take this long I'd have gone autocraft instead.

The fuel tank and dry sump tank are in. Fuel supply lines with pre filter, bosch 910 pump and magnaflow EFI after filter.

All ive done lately is to work on the plates on the chassis that the roll cage will bolt too. Everything I want to do next requires an engine to build around so the project is on hold till the heads arrive.

drgouk Slammed & Awesome Dubber

92 posts · joined Mar 2009 · 12 Apr 2009, 3:58 pm

#706557

Maybe darren has been spending to much time on this:
http://www.cal-look.com/forum/index.php?topic=29925.msg316339;topicseen#msg316339

Dealing with one man bands can be a pain in the arse. With his 5 axis cnc machine, there should be no hold ups once hes devloped the port shape. Hope you get your heads soon, so we get regular updates on this interesting thread. Top notch so far.

2443TT Fahrvergnugen

962 posts · joined Dec 2002 · 24 Apr 2009, 1:16 pm

#708780

I am the only one here right now, and I have many things to do, being the only one here. You heads were started, but not finished, the guy that was working on them, have left us to move back home, he was not repleced. I will advice you, that there are no sign of a recsession in the vw market, we have enough work at my shop till the end of the year end, pretty much normal for all of us in the vw market. You were told these items were going to built custom, and there was going to be a wait time for them. Time line rght now is, a few months to get them completed, when there done there done. If you can wait a few months, we will refund your money, a 25% restocking fee will applied to your down payment. Let me know what you want to do.

Somehow I think Daren at DRD takes on more work than he can handle. Then works on the projects in the order of who complains the most. Over 5 months since I placed my order and paid a $2100 deposit to begin manufacture. Now its another 3 months (maybe) with no firm date in sight.

Im considering getting a refund now and trying to source some autocraft heads instead now. Im so sick of bullshit and broken promises. Im going to die of old age before this project is ever finished.

dangerous 23 Windows of Awesome

5,901 posts · joined Jan 2005 · 24 Apr 2009, 1:26 pm

#708781

Get your money back dude.

westi wrote:That's mad Alan.

vassy66T1 Wow ... are U reading this?

2,120 posts · joined Jun 2003 · 24 Apr 2009, 1:26 pm

#708782

That is a real pain in the backside 😬

Yeh, it would be good if honesty was a little more prevalent so that you know what to expect and not get some half-baked answer from someone who is not organised and doesn't really know themselves what their timing is. It makes you nervous and leaves you feeling burnt. I hope it improves. The rest of your work is looking fantastic.

2443TT Fahrvergnugen

962 posts · joined Dec 2002 · 24 Apr 2009, 4:07 pm

#708805

Done and cancelled. On the bright side the Aussie dollar was at an all time high when I placed the order, so losing 25% isnt going to sting quite as badly now the dolar is down a bit since then.

So im now on the prowl for a set of decent autocraft heads. Im doing away with water cooling them too, and have decided to run air cooled and use E85 fuel instead. Possibly also using 8 injectors so I can look at methanol on the 2nd stage for high boost running.

The floor mounted radiators are now going th be used for water to air intercooling. I'll have some pics of them up by the end of the weekend work permitting...

Cheers,
Ian

Boostn Wolfsburg Wizard

657 posts · joined Apr 2005 · 25 Apr 2009, 2:07 am

#708879

Ian,

Not good news, but I can't say I am surprised. Some of the yanks are the best talkers and the fact that you are so far away you can't just go around and smash things. I am quite surprised that you just handed that sort of cash to drd as I have seen some of his heads and I was not impressed. You should have gone local or even tried them yourself. Better yet go back to the CB heads and just get it done. If you tune on it with e85 there is no need for meth and you will be shocked at how much power it will make.

Good luck

VOLLKOMMEN ART
nick@vollkommenart.com

Speed and Style

andrewmurphy Officially Full-On Dubber

307 posts · joined Jul 2005 · 25 Apr 2009, 10:37 am

#708899

Talking about E85 fuel, is it as corrosive as i have heard it is? I was talking about it with a guy who is involved in Toyota racing and if the fuel sits in the system for any legth of time it can cause problems so it is important to clean out the fuel system when not being used.

Mick058 Custom Title Time!

1,580 posts · joined Jan 2008 · 25 Apr 2009, 5:43 pm

#708947

Ian, thats crap! Really is! I hate seeing these guys in business - and 25% re-stocking, for doing crap all!!! Really disappointing mate. That really is a rort.

Hope all goes well with the rest of the project and am really enjoying the thread.

http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=67295 (myride)

Romans 10:9

Cam Custom Title Time!

1,535 posts · joined Aug 2002 · 26 Apr 2009, 12:01 pm

#709041

E85 is a fairly common fuel overseas, so I doubt it's going to be overly damaging. I think people have concerns about E85 still having small amounts of water in it from the distillation process. But when you consider that every petrol station has a huge amount of water in their tanks which apparently gets stirred up (along with all any rubbish in the tank) whenever the things are filled, I think you'll find plenty of moisture has already been through your fuel system over the years.
I've was told by someone ages ago (and I'm sure Nick will be able to tell you if my source was on crack) what could be a problem are your solid fuel lines; but replacing these with stainless items will solve any problems you may have with settled fuel.

Marko Learner Dubber

13 posts · joined Jun 2008 · 26 Apr 2009, 1:02 pm

#709046

http://www.jpmotorsport.se/s/ms230.htm

Really good heads and you can run E85 and if you drive street much better than Autocraft.

more: www.jpmotorsport.se

ricola Wolfsburg Wizard

437 posts · joined Feb 2003 · 27 Apr 2009, 3:11 am

#709199

That really sucks, he should be giving you 25% on top of your deposit for messing you around and wasting so much of your time! Pleased to hear you have some motivation to get back on track like you were before, this would have really pissed me off... 👎

http://www.ricola.co.uk

2443TT Fahrvergnugen

962 posts · joined Dec 2002 · 27 Apr 2009, 12:26 pm

#709254

Thanks for the link Marko, I like the look of those heads a lot and have sent an enquiry to see what options they can provide in terms of valve sizes, and of course pricing. Not chinese made too, so they have a lot going for them.

Yes ive got some motovation again. Things like this head drama really put a dampner of things though. I got stuck back into the car yesterday afternoon though and am 1/2 way done mounting the 2nd radiator in the floor. I'll post pics with they are done.

Cheers,
Ian

dangerous 23 Windows of Awesome

5,901 posts · joined Jan 2005 · 27 Apr 2009, 1:35 pm

#709265

Yes very nice heads.
I particularly like their rocker system with the extra stud on each end.

But normal Volksy rockers will fit straight on, if you have them already,
which is pretty cool.
I think some street guys in Euro have run N/A 10s ...that says it all I reckon.

westi wrote:That's mad Alan.

reub VWRX is gone...

2,054 posts · joined Sep 2002 · 27 Apr 2009, 1:45 pm

#709267

http://www.jpmotorsport.se/e/media.htm

R&D VW 1915cc engine
making power @ 9500rpm.
The pull (4000-9500rpm) is
made on a rolling road dyno.
Shiftlight starts at 8000rpm..
🙅

Reub

2443TT Fahrvergnugen

962 posts · joined Dec 2002 · 29 Apr 2009, 5:14 pm

#709700

Hi Guys,

Heard back from Johannes at JP motorsport today. The heads are actually cheaper than the DRD ones were going to cost me. I can get them in 48x40 valve configuration, but they dont offer other valve size combinations such as 44x44 which I would have prefferred. Either way it looks like i'll be placing an order very soon, so the engine will be air/oil cooled with steel cylinders in its final configuration. I considered Nikasil briefly but for the power I am after when the engine is tuned for dyno comps, its probable that I'd split a cylinder.

Cheers,
Ian

Turbo54 Veteran Volks Folk

2,220 posts · joined Jul 2004 · 29 Apr 2009, 5:48 pm

#709703

Are those heads the same ones that were first advertised on Shoptalkforums ages ago. They got a great wrap on there. I love the look of them and they will be an upgrade for me when I am sick of my current combo. Keep it up ian, cant wait to see it progress. Any pics of the radiators, I am interested to see how the fit.
Heath
T54

C'mon kids gather round,
there's a new sensation hitting town,
It's moving straight, low to the ground,
it'll pick you up when your feeling down.

2443TT Fahrvergnugen

962 posts · joined Dec 2002 · 29 Apr 2009, 6:13 pm

#709707

Sorry no radiator pics just yet. The fitment has required a little chassis welding which means some paint work needs to be touched up on the chassis. It had to be done anyway, to correct that Opps i made by not putting the mount points for the roll cage in the correct area. Its all sorted out now though.

So glad its going to be air cooled again. Less complexity, and the radiator setup will pretty much guarantee the water-air intercooler system will hold low air temps for sustained high boost runs. Im getting enthuesastic again!

With any luck i'll finish work at mid day tomorrow and will finish off the pasenger side radiator installation.

fullnoise Fahrvergnugen

964 posts · joined Sep 2002 · 29 Apr 2009, 9:35 pm

#709745

Don't get me started on DRD😬. I'm surprised he has any work at all.

Unfortunately he's another commercially dishonest yank who will tell you anything to get your money and then either stuff you around or send you a substandard product that won't flow what was promised, won't lift what was promised and the so called "racing valve job" doesn't even seal.

Your car is awesome Ian. DRD heads wouldn't do it justice.

esratrams

66deluxe Custom Title Time!

1,593 posts · joined Aug 2005 · 30 Apr 2009, 7:20 am

#709782

Yep DRD even has vids on his site on how he does his heads, doesn't even heat head and chill seat, just drives the seat home room tempreture with a drift and BFH. Go the JP heads, there excellent.

This is my Volkswagen, there are many like it, but this one is mine. Without me my Volkswagen is useless, without my Volkswagen, I am useless.

61 Karmann Ghia 2110cc type1 w Los Panchito's
66 Deluxe Beetle 2270 type 4
10 Subaru WRX Impreza