With all the talk lately about speed cameras and other topics on AVD, I have to say that I dont believe speed kills.
I have just up until recently spent the last 15 years as a copper and with the last 5 years I have been involved in serious and fatal collisions all around the state. And my thoughts are that it is the bad bloody drivers and/or their decisions that cause the collisions and deaths and not necessary their speed. People still die when collisions occur under the speed limits and these are still because of bad decisions. But these are not reported as separate collisions not involving speed. Statistics are there for the people that want to manipulate them and I have seen that done.
If speed kills, why have I just finished watching on TV the motor bike racing from the 'Isle of Man'. These are roads where the normal limits would range from 50-100kmph. Well how come motor bikes can do up to 175 MILES an hour and they are not dead. The speed didn't kill them, but had they made a bad decision or misjudged the roads then this would be different.
I just hate how the Government push the point that literally 'Speed Kills' and I don't agree. I fully understand the point they are trying to put across, but think they are wrong.
As a copper I have legally (lights and siren) exceeded the speed limit as a driver and passenger and this occurs every day by other police officers and will continue to occur. Yes there are the odd accidents, but 'no' the speed doesn't kill cops every day, maybe not even once a year. And just to clarify, I have been directly involved in the investigations of police cars involved in collisions where an officer has been killed.
And the TV add where the girl holds up her little pinky finger when a guys speeds past, I can't see how making out a person has a small penis has anything to do with how you drive. Does this mean men with large cocks are slow drivers, not at all. And if a woman drivers fast, what part of our anatomy do we hold up then?
I will say quite clearly, that I don't agree we should be able to drive at whatever speed we want and I am truly sorry to anyone out there that has lost someone to any road accident or for any other reason for that matter.
I just don't agree with all the speed limits and I think driver education and car handling courses should be taken more seriously and pushed as mandatory requirements to get a license and once a year from then on.
As police officers you go through extensive driver training, but this still doesn't make all police officer great drivers and I am not for one minute saying I am a great driver. I just cant see why its ok for police do drive at up to 100kmph over the speed limit and every other person on the road can get a speeding fine if you are doing 8-9kmph over the limit. I know that some police management will say they don't allow their officers to drive more than 30kmph over the limit, but in the real world this doesn't happen nor can it happen.
I did a 4-6 week stint in highway patrol and I have to say that these guys are the worst offenders of speeding and are one of the biggest hypocrites within the cops. There are others, but that is another story. I have not been able to voice my thoughts really until recently, but for as long as I can remember I have disagreed with the speed limits and that speed kills.
Please remember, we are all entitled to an opinion and this is an open forum for discussion. So please feel free (as you are) to respond whether you agree or not. But keep in mind the area I have worked in and why I have this opinion.
Cheers, Kev
P.S. These are my personal views and not as a representative of the Police Force.
I thought rebuilding a VW would be cheap - Shit I was wrong, just don't let the wife know !!!!
Click here for my (slowy) modded 1961 Beetle build.ive been doing... highway speeds for 2 days from bris 2 melb, now heading home, only time i was concerned about speedo more than the road/traffic around me was in F***** victoria, their system of suprise cameras & such is horrid, they lie too, "saftey cameras in use in vic" bullshit, you can rip skids infront of them, no photo, have an accident in front of, no photo, tailgate, no photo, speed 10k over the limit... yep photo. i watched them flash the cars ahead of me repeatedly
oh and kev, its not the speed, its the sudden stop 🙂 have avoided those so far(no im not driving currently)
Volkswagen Drivers Club of Queensland - member 🙂
STIDUB - yep its still a work in progress
Vwdcq club car racing/ and crashing while my bug isn't finished.
The above are personal views, no more, no less
Geez Kev, That's been brewing away for a few years by the look of it - bet it feels good to get that off your chest.👍
Couldn't agree more, mate, and I commend you for having the 'guts' to put all that down!👍
Cheers, Greg
I'd rather wear a Beetle out by racing it than by polishing it!
umm well it can if u goin really fast n hit a tree. but i some what agree wit u sentiments. license testing should involve judgement for distance speed/ time etc. people learn how to drive without any idea of how fast a car coming toward them is travelling, hence no idea if its safe to go or not. no judgement as to how close another car is, hence waiting for no reason or not moving fast enuff so as not to cause the other driver a problem. we need speed limits, but more flexibilty in enforcing the law would be much fairer. and a better licensing system would be better. something that would involve judgement decisions. my2cents worth
The secret is DON"T HIT A TREE!
I'd rather wear a Beetle out by racing it than by polishing it!
Wow, big post Kev, on a big subject. I couldn't agree more, as a certain alertness is required when driving and when trying to sustain this at 100km/h isn't easy. There was a post in the speed camera thread recently with a good explanation of what I'm saying. And also there's fact that driving in Australia these day's, you need to spend a high percentage of your time/focus on watching the bloody speedo as there's so little leeway with going over the limit 👎👎👎.
Anyway, good on ya Kev.
Matt Berry Motorsports...air cooled advice, repairs and mods Ph 0408 704 662
OFF-ROAD,CIRCUIT,DRAG,STREET,ENDURANCE
People should take driving more seriously.
It is not your loungeroom. Not a place for phone calls, SMS, iPod fiddling, CD changing, mascara or lipstick fashion time.
Two hands on the wheel, use your eyes, mirrors, brains and think about what you are doing.
That is why the racecar riders and drivers do some extreme driving, The milliseconds decisions based on concentration, instead of daydreaming.
If you are driving on the road, concentrate on the road and what is happening around you.
Totally agree with you Kev about the drivers, up here they keep blaming the roads and there's nothing wrong with them just people who try to overtake at exactly the wrong time and/or place and when it doesn't kill them it kills somebody else. Glad you got it off your chest👍
Good One Kev...
every time someone makes a mistake on Our roads and someone dies...
its all speed.... !!
many accidents happened in the country when its raining... drivers under the speed limit...
but on a slippery smooth surface on a corner...
car goes under a truck.... fatalities... yes
but its well known locally , the driver had a big fight with His family, put His family into the car and drove off...
so, it wasn't Speed Kills....
it was an irate driver kills...
anyway... good one Kev..
Lee
- Helping keep Air Cooled VWs on the road - location: SCONE in the Upper Hunter Valley - Northern NSW 320 kms NNW of SYDNEY---
I totally agree as well Kev, especially with far better driver training and recurrent testing.
As a young bloke I did a lot of gravel road and country road driving, and it gave you a very good idea of what the car was capable of, when it was liable to start to lose traction, what actions would make you lose control, and how to tell as soon as things were starting to go wrong and what you needed to do immediatly to rectify the situation. This was all before 100kmh limits, and I used to drive between 120 and 140kmh all the time.
Ever since they brought in 100kmh limits, I have struggled to keep concentration and suffer from fatigue when driving, because instead of constantly monitoring your speed in relation the road or weather conditions, you are now 'veging' away doing very little except checking the speedo to see if you are doing the posted limit, even though it usually bears no relation to the road or weather conditions.
The suggestions that you should do nothing else except "concentrate on your driving" is all very well, but when there is nothing within a bulls roar to concentrate on, it makes concentration very difficult to sustain for any long period. I usually get lollies that I have to open, play car number plate names or all sorts of other things to stop my mind going into 'screen saver' mode.
From your ole' mate Jeff
Good posts. Just this afternoon I drove past a Honda S2000 that had speared off the road into a fence, just after taking a corner. It had been raining lightly on and off all day, and genius had obviously got on the power way too early, lost traction and headed straight into the bushes. He is exceptionally unlikely to have been speeding, he just had insufficient car skills.
i agree that the system of driving training we now have is totally inadequate - except whichever government implements an appropriate system with licensed driving trainers, simulators to train and test all aspects of driving and recurrent testing will probably make themselves very unpopular - would be unlikely to risk their next election on it. Shame really - so many people get killed every year on our roads and our fickle politicians have the power to do something about it - they just lack the testicular fortitude to do so.
beetleboyjeff wrote:I totally agree as well Kev, especially with far better driver training and recurrent testing.
As a young bloke I did a lot of gravel road and country road driving, and it gave you a very good idea of what the car was capable of, when it was liable to start to lose traction, what actions would make you lose control, and how to tell as soon as things were starting to go wrong and what you needed to do immediatly to rectify the situation. This was all before 100kmh limits, and I used to drive between 120 and 140kmh all the time.
Ever since they brought in 100kmh limits, I have struggled to keep concentration and suffer from fatigue when driving, because instead of constantly monitoring your speed in relation the road or weather conditions, you are now 'veging' away doing very little except checking the speedo to see if you are doing the posted limit, even though it usually bears no relation to the road or weather conditions.
The suggestions that you should do nothing else except "concentrate on your driving" is all very well, but when there is nothing within a bulls roar to concentrate on, it makes concentration very difficult to sustain for any long period. I usually get lollies that I have to open, play car number plate names or all sorts of other things to stop my mind going into 'screen saver' mode.
You need to get out in the Volkswagen a bit more Jeff! After the cars of today only idling over at around 1900 RPM/110kmh the VW seems busy at 3500 RPM plus for the same speed. Not sure I can handle the noise going north on Friday!
🙅
Agreed on the coppers re some of them breaking plenty of road rules but hell bent on pinging others. First hand knowledge on this!
1. Fail to stop at stop signs because "what a stupid place to put that"
2. U-turns in the main street of a big country town north of Lee when the sign clearly showed NO U-TURN.
3. Continually breaking speed limit.
4. Going through red lights. How do I know this??!! Because HE was driving my daughters car and as it was registered in my name I got a bill! Mind you that got sorted out bloody quick!
😂
The list goes on Camo as you would know. Lucky we have better cars now as well as better roads as there are only half the people getting killed now in NSW as there were per year in the late 60s, early 70s with about twice the population now.
DH
beetleboyjeff wrote:I totally agree as well Kev, especially with far better driver training and recurrent testing.
As a young bloke I did a lot of gravel road and country road driving, and it gave you a very good idea of what the car was capable of, when it was liable to start to lose traction, what actions would make you lose control, and how to tell as soon as things were starting to go wrong and what you needed to do immediatly to rectify the situation. This was all before 100kmh limits, and I used to drive between 120 and 140kmh all the time.
Ever since they brought in 100kmh limits, I have struggled to keep concentration and suffer from fatigue when driving, because instead of constantly monitoring your speed in relation the road or weather conditions, you are now 'veging' away doing very little except checking the speedo to see if you are doing the posted limit, even though it usually bears no relation to the road or weather conditions.
The suggestions that you should do nothing else except "concentrate on your driving" is all very well, but when there is nothing within a bulls roar to concentrate on, it makes concentration very difficult to sustain for any long period. I usually get lollies that I have to open, play car number plate names or all sorts of other things to stop my mind going into 'screen saver' mode.
This is a bit one for me too, but more that fact that all cars now are made for lazy people. After I converted my commodore to manual, I found its made me like 5 fold more alert and constantly thinking about driving not vegging out with cruse on.
71 notchback,
Past owner of, 70 NB, 73 SB and 72 FB TLE
Hi
Good post Kevin.
The reason that the government concentrate on speed so much is that it can be measured and acted on, cross a set speed and your gone.
Unfortunately nobody has made an automatic dickhead detector yet, if they did the RTA and government would jump onto it right away.
By dickhead I mean the people in the right lane on freeways or over 80 kph zones, the idiots that jump in front of trucks as they preparing to stop at lights, people that are obviously lost and drive along looking for house numbers at 20 - 30 kph under the limit oblivious to those behind them, I could go on.
I suppose that there used to be dickhead detectors, they drove around in police cars, they seem to be few and far between these days.
Steve
But are the laws of speed for our safety or simply a basic implementation for a bit of revenue?
Is it only a myth or is it tru that the cops get bonus'es for dishing out fines?
Law and justice are 2 very different things.
btw i agree solely on the original post. the majority of acidents are related to driver error rather than mechanical failure, and speed is not error, its how its handled that makes u hit that tree or drive through someones house.
(ô_!_/ô) (ô_!_/ô)
69' baja: kombi box, thing spindles, irs, disc front, type 3 rear drums, 2 inch lift kit, 31x10 rears. 👍
New engine in process: 94mm p&bs, 74mm C/w chomol Crank, 35.5x39 SP heads, turbo. Wierd combo, hopeful torque monsta!
Congratulations Kev, on an 'award-winning' post - if there is such a thing. People are responding with their own ideas and experiences, which is really great. I like Steve's 'dick-head detector' idea - how much better would that be than a radar gun in preventing accidents?
I say 'accidents' because that's what they are called, but are they? An accident is something that could not be avoided, is it not?
Having driven thousands of miles in vintage (pre 1931) cars, I agree that today's cars are so comfortable, quiet, and just plain boring, that it's hard to keep awake when you are floating along at mind-numbing speeds. In the 'old' car you are busy at all times, fiddling with ign. timing, mixture, etc. The ride, handling, and wind alone make sure that you never doze off!
What can we do about all this? Who knows, but at least we are talking about it, and that is at least something positive.👍 Thank you Kevin.
Cheers, Greg
I'd rather wear a Beetle out by racing it than by polishing it!
The faster you are going the less time you have to react, therefore a crash is more likely if you go faster.
The faster you are going the more serious any crash will be.
So yes: more speed makes it more likely that someone will be killed. To try to pretend otherwise is stupid. Slow down and save lives.
1959 red & white Beetle
1975 Kombi camper
Yea but if someone was unco enough to drive off a cliff at 5km/h, its not speed that kills them, its stupidity.
I don't think anyone is saying to go 200kmph down the m1, i think the suggestion here is that too much focus and $ is put on speeding cameras which don't stop people speeding till a month later when they recieve the fine in the mail, rather its about educating drivers properly so they can at the very least handle normal road speeds.
The 'racing car driver' analogy was proof that with proper training, it doesn't matter what speed your doing, you can ensure your own survival.
(ô_!_/ô) (ô_!_/ô)
69' baja: kombi box, thing spindles, irs, disc front, type 3 rear drums, 2 inch lift kit, 31x10 rears. 👍
New engine in process: 94mm p&bs, 74mm C/w chomol Crank, 35.5x39 SP heads, turbo. Wierd combo, hopeful torque monsta!
Nice words and thoughts in your post, Kev. Well done.
I just (over the past three years) taught my three daughters how to drive (last one still on L Plates) and I've tried to impress upon them the importance of concentration and treating driving as a priveiledge rather than a right which is what the late Mr Brock once told me at a driving course I did.
My youngest is as keen as mustard to really drive a car properly and that lead me to thinking that she should join a car club like I did when I was in my late teens and early twenties so that we could do lap dash's and super sprints in our road cars (that we'd spent some time hotting-up) and really learn so much about car control. The trouble is that nowadays there aren't the facilities that we had then. Where are the replacements for Amaroo Park (lap dash, dirt circuit and hillclimb), Oran Park, and even the one in Katoomba that I can't remember the name of? At least we will be able to do some laps of Eastern Creek I suppose, but it doesn't have the same feel as the variety available when I was using them every second weekend. Ooops, now I sound like an old fart harping on about the good ole days, but I do think we have to educate young drivers about the responsibility of learning real car control, as wel as an outlet for the rev-head in all of us! I know that when I used to drive home from Amaroo on a Sunday afternoon, all of the joy of the day's racing had me driving nice and slow!
Driving is an art that cannot just be learnt driving mum to Westfield and back to get up your hours. Concentration is key.
I'm Kent Brockman, and that's MY two cents... 👍
Baja
1915cc's of raw power 🙅
Turbocharger
Intercooler
EFI
Crank fired Ignition
Runs E85
Engineered
"The Lord does not subtract from the life of a man, the hours spent on his Volkswagen" Anon.
bajachris88 wrote:Yea but if someone was unco enough to drive off a cliff at 5km/h...
😂2.0slow 92 MK2
Made in Germany, Assembled in Africa, 'Migrated' to Australia
Great post Kev, I support your argument 100%.
Soon people are going to be just watching there speedos rather than the road and accidents and road tolls will go up. Then the government will reduce the speed limits because 'speed kills' and eventually we will all be chuffing along the freeways at a blisteringly fast 40km/h.
I see almost every weekend a new saftey camera in campbelltown that causes so many near misses with people afraid to go through the lights on amber or speed up to get through. It's definitely increasing safety 🤪 with so many new accidents at that intersection.
This government is so corrupt and is looking for any possible way to tax people. If only everyone united and kick these !@#$'s out.
Thats not rust, it's ah ... orange primer ... yep that's what it is ...
You are right about the lack of venues for developing driving skills, Kent (it was Catalina Park at Katoomba, by the way), and nothing seems to be improving - in NSW at least.👎
When my two sons got their licences at age 17, we sent them straight to Peter Finlay's Advanced Driving School - a good move. Now in their 40's, they both enjoy good driving records, and their motorsport.👍
Driver education and the development of driving skills are sadly neglected, instead of being encouraged! SHAME on those in control.👎
Cheers, Greg
P.S........ Sorry to keep on about this, but I do feel strongly about the dangers and lack of ability on the road. It would not be tolerated in the 'workplace'.
I'd rather wear a Beetle out by racing it than by polishing it!
bajachris88 wrote:Yea but if someone was unco enough to drive off a cliff at 5km/h
ahh but if they'd only been doing 3km/h they might have been able to stop before the cliff
😉1959 red & white Beetle
1975 Kombi camper
haha good call Martin i didn't see that coming 😁
(ô_!_/ô) (ô_!_/ô)
69' baja: kombi box, thing spindles, irs, disc front, type 3 rear drums, 2 inch lift kit, 31x10 rears. 👍
New engine in process: 94mm p&bs, 74mm C/w chomol Crank, 35.5x39 SP heads, turbo. Wierd combo, hopeful torque monsta!
Catalina! That's right! Even remember some go-karting around there too!
Baja
1915cc's of raw power 🙅
Turbocharger
Intercooler
EFI
Crank fired Ignition
Runs E85
Engineered
"The Lord does not subtract from the life of a man, the hours spent on his Volkswagen" Anon.
Thanks for all the feedback and am glad to read all of the responses, now if we could only get through to the people responsible - fat chance and then there is no common sense used when these people do get these jobs.
Purple Martin - As I said, was happy to hear responses for and against. I fully understand your point about the cliff senario, but think if you were traveling along a street and because you were driving 4-5kmph faster than the speed limit this in fact saved you from getting T-Boned from some idiot not driving to his ability or the conditions. Then the speed would have actually saved you.
There is always 2 ways to look at everything and like bajachris88 said and I, we are not talking about driving at 200kmph.
Also bajachris88, there was no bonus or reward in the NSW Police to get extra tickets so I say it is just a myth. But some coppers do have competitions against each another to see whom can outdo whom. But still no reward incentives.
Thanks all, Kev
I thought rebuilding a VW would be cheap - Shit I was wrong, just don't let the wife know !!!!
Click here for my (slowy) modded 1961 Beetle build.Purple Martin wrote:bajachris88 wrote:Yea but if someone was unco enough to drive off a cliff at 5km/h
ahh but if they'd only been doing 3km/h they might have been able to stop before the cliff
😉
ahh but if they'd been really smart, they wouldn't even have a car. I suppose they could be struck by lightning while walking along the cliff-top. Oh well, sooner or later, you've gotta go I suppose.
🥲I'd rather wear a Beetle out by racing it than by polishing it!
The thing that's always amazed me is on the news they always say "police believe that speed may have been a factor"... yes of course it was a factor, if he was going slower he MAY have stopped sooner and MAY have had a lesser impact. Forget the speed related MAY's tho... improving driver training and testing MAY have stopped the accident happening in the first place, but govt never goes anywhere near that one !!!
Also on speed camera's now being "traffic safety cameras".... to me there's a major flaw there that they only measure to the speed limit, and don't do anything at all about road conditions, so how the hell are they monitoring safety !?!?!
The only place I've seen that does take conditions conditions into account is the uphill section of the F3 North bound near Brooklyn where it's a 100 limit in the dry, and 90 in the wet... and the camera's supposedly know and record against this. Thing is, in almost 10 years of commuting up and down that road when it was 110 limit I don't think I ever saw an accident in that section in either the wet or the dry !!! The downhill section on the South bound side yes, but never the North bound.
I've never seen anything attempted about the other factors in conditions... visibility, amount of traffic on the road etc.
To me if the money taken from speed cameras was 100% spent on improving the roads, driver education etc. rather than just going into government coffers, I think there'd be a lot less distrust and anger about speed cameras full stop.
VWDCQ vice pres & web dude - vwdcqinc.org.au
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'70 Hillclimb Bug 'Jezebel' w/- Haltech EFI -
http://bit.ly/VwTNtQ
'60 KG Coupe - resto kinda started
01 New Beetle - gf's car, but I turn the spanners
Oh and hey - the new "mobile speed cameras" that they have now in NSW, where the govt has promoted how they're using 6 Ford Territory's, and the news images show they have very obvious flash lights and other gizmo's on the roof.
If they were serious about improving safety... why didn't they use 6 cars all different but the same models as normal govt fleet cars, and then sticker that 6 plus EVERY OTHER govt fleet car the same with very obvious "I COULD BE A SPEED CAMERA" type signage on all four sides ???
Then for very little cost you have the exact same revenue as the 6 Territory's, but the increased awareness benefit as if it was several thousand speed camera cars. Can't tell me that wouldn't make a difference to people's driving behaviour !!!
👍
VWDCQ vice pres & web dude - vwdcqinc.org.au
Join a car club - get car peeps
My toys
'70 Hillclimb Bug 'Jezebel' w/- Haltech EFI -
http://bit.ly/VwTNtQ
'60 KG Coupe - resto kinda started
01 New Beetle - gf's car, but I turn the spanners
100% correct .... Speed doesn't kill , its the really sudden stop when you hit something.
somebody had to say it ....🤪
Aerodynamics are for people who cant build engines - Enzo Ferrari
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