I guess my point is, some people have time and $$$ to learn and pour into it but other just pay to get it done. And like Matt said, some people are more committed to important detail than others. Some build and some just assemble.
Re the web and info. Sadly, it's seems more full of crap myths than it is real info. It takes a few years to figure out one from the other and that's usually learnt expensively too. ๐
Guys sounds like a really healthy debate and it looks like some poelpe love VW engines and would not consider changing. Thats great.
There are many benifits, one being that you may be able to build and work on your own aircooled engine... a dream come true and the reason many of us are actually involved with VWs.
But, and there may never be AN answer...
A Subie powered VW offers a high powered low maintence engine at a reduced cost to a high powered all out VW engine.
Damo, I appreciate your input because you have both and love them for different reasons.
Good points in your post re rebuild. What sort of dollars would you spend in doing a quality rebuild on an Sti engine?
I know a rebuild of a turbo alone is a motza, and then your injectors, blah, blah.
Matt, I appreciate the passion that drives you to build the best that you can and not be satisfied for less.
I get to enjoy that everyday. ๐
I think I can live without the recommendations of any person who thinks a V6 commodore is a good thing to fit to a type 3 vw ๐
Who cares about some guys dyno run in shootout mode ๐คช๐คช๐คช
Why would you bother to run a stock commodore on a dyno ?
Was ther any improvements made or are you just after a print out that you would be happy with ?
I have driven several commodore V6's they were all very boring and sooooo slow, so wake up and smell the roses , fit a modern golf Engine to your Type 3 then you will see some real improvments.
If you must have 6cyls why not consider a VW VR6 engine much more compact than a commodore.
I think the points I made were valid , you don't have to agree I never thought for a minute that you would.
๐
Craig Torrens6 times Australian, 7 times State Hillclimb Class Champion
I waved the Pobjoy/VW flag today on my way to work........when my 1916 flogged a WRX ๐
And yes, we have all built VW motors...............but you said "decent" which to me means 140hp+, (or about 100hp more than what you're capable of bolting together !)
Aussie Dubbin wrote:A Subie powered VW offers a high powered low maintence engine at a reduced cost to a high powered all out VW engine.
Can we agree on that statement maybe?...
Yep, I totally agree with that statement. BUT it's another story if you substituted 'high powered' with 'high performance'. That to me is another kettle of fish as it's the performance that suffers when an ill handling car is driven to the limit. Sure Subi powered cars can go fast, very fast. We all know that a Dub is overly rear wieght biased, increasing the rear bias is not up there on recommendations to make your car handle better. One day when you have one of 'those' moments, in your Volksie powered car you may collect it and have to clean out your undies......but in your Subi pendulum machine, I'll bet, all other things being equal, you'll have a monumental and be cleaning more than just undies.
vassy66T1 wrote:I get to enjoy that everyday. ๐
Cheers mate, glad you enjoy the fahrvergnugen. ๐
PS, I don't dislike the power available going Subi, just erks me that so many VW owners have missed the boat with how good a Volksie can go, stop and turn. Not really the VW owners at fault, just too many bad VW mechanics out there.
Matt Berry Motorsports...air cooled advice, repairs and mods Ph 0408 704 662
OFF-ROAD,CIRCUIT,DRAG,STREET,ENDURANCE
And yes, we have all built VW motors...............but you said "decent" which to me means 140hp+, (or about 100hp more than what you're capable of bolting together !) ๐๐ฅฒ [/quote]
Cruel words Craig
but this time its you who is a long way off the mark.๐
Brian wrote:And yes, we have all built VW motors...............but you said "decent" which to me means 140hp+, (or about 100hp more than what you're capable of bolting together !) ๐๐ฅฒ
Cruel words Craig
but this time its you who is a long way off the mark.๐ [/quote]
Rexy boys have gone to sleep.......one of these damn waterpumpers arived in my shed today.. now there's 2 of em in there !!!!!!!!! AARRRRG hope they don't breed.
Matt Berry Motorsports...air cooled advice, repairs and mods Ph 0408 704 662
OFF-ROAD,CIRCUIT,DRAG,STREET,ENDURANCE
I dont want to talk about this subject any more , can we all move the photo section and just post photos of girls and hot Vws cause I am liking that greatly
Looking for that special lady : PM me for coffee & cake
Seagull, a VW motor that puts out 200ps for 50 bucks? oh yeah, plenty about ๐ ๐ ๐
There's a time and a place, the one that just rolled in to my workshop is one that fits the bill, but it has over 500rwhp, has extended length rear trailing arms (5" longer) and beam moved forward to get the vehicle ballance back to something respectable. And this is for a baja, that is never going to handle too well.The point is, not all applications are Subi's going to be faster or handle better.
Matt Berry Motorsports...air cooled advice, repairs and mods Ph 0408 704 662
OFF-ROAD,CIRCUIT,DRAG,STREET,ENDURANCE
pete wood wrote:I guess my point is, some people have time and $$$ to learn and pour into it but other just pay to get it done. And like Matt said, some people are more committed to important detail than others. Some build and some just assemble.
Re the web and info. Sadly, it's seems more full of crap myths than it is real info. It takes a few years to figure out one from the other and that's usually learnt expensively too. ๐
Very true Pete....sadly its dyno figures that cause this problem as well๐
matberry wrote:Seagull, a VW motor that puts out 200ps for 50 bucks? oh yeah, plenty about ๐ ๐ ๐
There's a time and a place, the one that just rolled in to my workshop is one that fits the bill, but it has over 500rwhp, has extended length rear trailing arms (5" longer) and beam moved forward to get the vehicle ballance back to something respectable. And this is for a baja, that is never going to handle too well.The point is, not all applications are Subi's going to be faster or handle better.
the silly wrecker who could not see it was a EJ20R with 62 k on the dash
Power output ranges from 200 PS @ 6000 rpm and 260 Nm for the GT to 220 PS @ 6400 rpm and 270 Nm for the RS versions. Engines can be identified by coil on plug with 2 M6 bolts per coil and valve covers with 4CAM 16VALVE and horizontal lines above and below the plug holes. All these engines have the air-to-water intercooler setup (chargecooler) and Oil squirters.
Looking for that special lady : PM me for coffee & cake
I REALLLLY like Ferraris, but the engine is cantankerous, and it costs a lot, so I'm going to stick a Briggs and Stratton in the back. I know it doesn't SOUND the same, but it still looks cool when it's parked...
I think I can live without the recommendations of any person who thinks a V6 commodore is a good thing to fit to a type 3 vw ๐
Who cares about some guys dyno run in shootout mode ๐คช๐คช๐คช
Why would you bother to run a stock commodore on a dyno ?
Was ther any improvements made or are you just after a print out that you would be happy with ?
I have driven several commodore V6's they were all very boring and sooooo slow, so wake up and smell the roses , fit a modern golf Engine to your Type 3 then you will see some real improvments.
If you must have 6cyls why not consider a VW VR6 engine much more compact than a commodore.
I think the points I made were valid , you don't have to agree I never thought for a minute that you would.
๐
Thats not my dyno chart just some pic I found on google.
139kw is an improvement. stock is like 120? for a ecotec at the wheels. so probably around the 165Kw at the flywheel judging from that chart.
slow? perhaps you driven onwards of vs ? yes they are slow cos they weight 1500kg+ and has a parasitic auto tanrrys that weigh around 100kg. Freshened up a VP-VS with a T5 manual (28kg~ tranny) go very hard especially at the bottom end.
I wouldn't really want to put a V6 into a type 3 unless I was bored with heaps of money to throw away.
My point is they are considered one of the top engines of all time witch outstanding longevity, driveability and amazing simplicity/compactness/accessibility.
VR6 engine? never really thought of that? but I have though as an idea to place an ecotec into a VW golf lol
71 notchback,
Past owner of, 70 NB, 73 SB and 72 FB TLE
A V6 in kombi would be a good option, the added weight really wont effect handling that much as there's not much of it to start with ad the torque would be perfect for getting a loaded brick moving but a V6 in a type3??
That would corner like a bucket of shit.
Might pop mean wheelies, but that and straight line would be all it's good for.
A VR6 mid mounted would handle slightly better but it's not like it's an elegant or practical option.
Joel wrote:A V6 in kombi would be a good option, the added weight really wont effect handling that much as there's not much of it to start with ad the torque would be perfect for getting a loaded brick moving but a V6 in a type3??
That would corner like a bucket of shit.
Might pop mean wheelies, but that and straight line would be all it's good for.
A VR6 mid mounted would handle slightly better but it's not like it's an elegant or practical option.
VR6 would be my choice of all๐....midmounted would be better balanced, than again in a tube chassis๐
Probably cos most of us don't like the cars only the engines.
I'd rather a professional subaru conversion than a hacked up ill-handling vw conversion just for the sake of keeping it in the family.
It's not like the world is ever gonna run out of unmolested VWs anyway, there's only several millions of them left.
All the purists have that base covered ๐
