vlad01 wrote:I was referring to the VB- VN ish? turana, gemini, astra, omega, vectra etc.. they were based of the Open body and chassis.
Yes, they're all based on GM Global cars. Why is this a surprise? It's not like Holden "aren't Holden anymore". All Holdens have shared design elements and even architectures with other GM products. Let's have an example! What car is this?
It's a Chevrolet Fleetline. Now, compare to the 48/215 Holden.
Notice any similarities? These two aren't actually the same car, but the original Holden design began as a design for a compact Chevrolet which never made it to production. The point is that a global car is what you make it, and the Aussie workers at Holden have been localising global GM products since the very beginning. The Torana may have started out as a Vauxhall, but it was Holden who stretched the nose to make it long enough for a six cylinder engine. Similarly, the VN-VT Holden Commodore models are actually wider than the European Opel/Vauxhall versions. The engines and drivetrains are local, the bodyshell is modified and they are manufactured and assembled here in Australia.
To try and drag my post back on topic, Ford Australia are of course the same. The Falcon started out as a US model and was progressively localised more and more. The Falcon six cylinder engine which is still used today has evolved from that humble six cylinder which came out from the US in the first Aussie built Falcon. It is a brilliant engine, especially in XR6 Turbo form, but tragically it is the last Australian-developed engine still in production. The Holden 5 litre was replaced by the Gen 3 back in the VT days and the Holden-developed version of the Buick 3.8 litre V6 ceased to be with the introduction of the Alloytec V6 in the VZ. So, the Falcon lump is the last man standing. Unfortunately it's future doesn't look bright beyond the introduction of Euro 5 emissions in a couple of years' time.
yes the point exactly. Nearly all people recognize Holden as being a strictly Aussie dreamed up, designed and built cars.
People often get offended when you point out the facts of their design history. But thats fan boys for ya. Our family is a ford family with the exception of me of course.
I am the only one who has something besides a ford. The last good ford we had was a 78 Cortina. Dam that was reliable and went well. I haven't seen a single ford without serious engine problems since the Cortina. Every one of the 6 or 7 ford we have gone through had head cracking and gasket problem and they all leaked oil like a sieve from day one. I bought a VP when I just finished high school and its still my first get around car and I do 600-1000 ks a week. Goes like a shower of shit on steroids with the body of an old man 😂 never had engine problems, no leaks, stays clean and never lets me down (well maybe manifold gasket went, no biggy). Oh and plenty of torque to boot.
I definitely made the right choice for a get around car. Plan to buy another one, white this time to solve the paint fade/peal problem 🥲😀 I only want to buy another one for cosmetic reasons and I want to move to ecotech as they are somewhat better than the EV6(aka sII buick?)
71 notchback,
Past owner of, 70 NB, 73 SB and 72 FB TLE
I did my apprenticeship with Ford in the 90s.They were doing strange things then and before that.
The EB11,ED,EF11 and EL Falcons wernt that bad,and at the time built better than Commodore I thought.Their factory gas for those latter Falcons was great for the company,being used for Taxis.
There was talk back then that the Falcon would be phased out,and the Saw ass(Tauras) would take over.I remember pulling the subframes and Autos on those heaps under warranty.
Because they are were ridiculously ugly, sales were shit.
The talk back then was Falcon out,Tauras,Mondeo,Focus and Explorer in(and Transit).
Which meant all new tooling and diagnostics and training.
Then all of a sudden,the AU appeared.Oh Ow.
I really think it was done(new AU series)so that Ford could still race V8s in Supercar.
I used to be a proud Ford man,I still own a XC Fairmont.
It was my Grandfathers,he was a Ford man.
Ford is now embaressing.
GM isnt far behind saying,
Hope Our Luck Doesnt End Now.It will
Yep I wouldn't buy either now. 96 is my limit on holden and 79? I think for ford.
I drove a SV6 VE for a few days in newcastle. was alright but lacked throttle control-ability. was impossible to curse at a consistent speed and was forever changing gears and had a rather large throttle response margin.
Sport shift mode proved a bit better. They also lacked the bottom end oomph. I much prefer the ecotec and pre ecotec engines as they have better characteristics.
The alloytec being chev based makes a nice sound at top end but being chev based doesn't fill me with confidence.
For me I wouldn't buy any ford after escort and cortina and for holden I wouldn't buy anything besides VP-VR and VS possibly a gemini or turana with ecotec fitted 😁
bloody gemini and turana rust like a coke can in the sea. 🙄 but a nice and simple looking car none the less.
I want to drive my half bro's XY GT and see what that is like, should be good since it is a 71 car.
71 notchback,
Past owner of, 70 NB, 73 SB and 72 FB TLE
well vlad if you want an ecotec you need a vs commy,but saying that,in my earlier years i was all holden ,then in my 30s to mid 40`s i was a ford man with xd's xf's and an ea and ebII ,then i had a drive of my sons vs commy and like vlad says it went heaps better than the ford and now i have a vs commy as well,and to end my rant or rave or whatever it is ,try buying a falcon station wagon as they have been phased out now...
meetings 1st sunday of the month
check wbsite for location
All Welcome
http://www.flatfour.org/
and on Facebook
https://www.facebook.com/FlatFourI almost bought a practically NOS white VS berlina. Was immaculate condition and was only 43,000k on it 👍 Deceased estate.🤓
I want to get either an acclaim or berlina VS in white paint.
White paint lasts a long time, the berlina and acclaim have IRS and shit all over the live axle model in the handling department and not to mention IRS diffs are easy to buy as reco units, no one seems to touch the live axle diffs and I have only been able to find average to poor used ones for my VP.
Belina is a bit better as the chrome trim on the seals acts like sunscreen. The holdens were renown for crap crumbly seals. At only 2000 buks for a complete NOS seal set its a steal!
I had a chat to the local mech that I buy my stuff off about my later plan to buy a white VS and rebuilt it ground up to become a 0K car. He goes "Do it! just do" "it will be a great car"
??? not what I expected coming from a valiant guy. I gather they last a long time? 400k +
I saw a red acclaim on fleabay with apparently original engine 837,000Km 🤪 Is that even possible?
71 notchback,
Past owner of, 70 NB, 73 SB and 72 FB TLE
Ford has been LOSING 25% of sales because they stopped
building the LPG Falcon because they were working on a NEW LPG system...
Yes... They LOST 25% of Falcon sales they couldn't really afford to...??
Other companies can phase out one and start another around the same time or stock UP with old models.....
. Not STOP all together???
the New LPG Falcon gets slightly MORE Power than the Petrol version...
BUT they LOST Sales... waiting and engineering etc...
some really dumb leadership there....???
or they will Disappear from Australian manufacturing...
If You can Sell a Vehicle... then Keep making them.... ????
LEE
- Helping keep Air Cooled VWs on the road - location: SCONE in the Upper Hunter Valley - Northern NSW 320 kms NNW of SYDNEY---
well, they did keep flogging the dead horse longer than you would imagine in the panelvan and ute market. They were flogging those xfs for a long long time, long after the sedan had gone. if they had a wagon today I think it would literal holden in the fleet market easy. But that dont mean it would make money.
68AutoBug wrote:Ford has been LOSING 25% of sales because they stopped
building the LPG Falcon because they were working on a NEW LPG system...
Lee, Ford stopped building the old E-Gas Falcon because it was outlawed by the new emissions laws. The E-Gas system didn't comply with the current level of emissions standards when they were introduced and it would've cost Ford too much money to bring it up to spec. The new liquid-injection system which they have now is a huge leap forwards in technology, it's possibly the most advanced LPG car which you can buy anywhere in the world.
if they had a wagon today I think it would OUTSELL holden in the fleet market easy.
wrote that reply on the phone, stupid predictive text.
i mean the wagon fleet because I dont think the commodore wagon is the traditional "big roomy box on the back of a sedan" that they used to be.
waveman1500 wrote:68AutoBug wrote:Ford has been LOSING 25% of sales because they stopped
building the LPG Falcon because they were working on a NEW LPG system...
Lee, Ford stopped building the old E-Gas Falcon because it was outlawed by the new emissions laws. The E-Gas system didn't comply with the current level of emissions standards when they were introduced and it would've cost Ford too much money to bring it up to spec. The new liquid-injection system which they have now is a huge leap forwards in technology, it's possibly the most advanced LPG car which you can buy anywhere in the world.
I read where Hyundai has been selling a liquid injection LPG car overseas but didn't sell it in Australia as they would have to pay royalties to an Australian company who engineered it.
LEE
interesting when You don't know the full story [ford e-gas]
- Helping keep Air Cooled VWs on the road - location: SCONE in the Upper Hunter Valley - Northern NSW 320 kms NNW of SYDNEY---
I went shopping for a new car a little while ago.
Wanted something very quick and very comfortable, had to be good for long drive and not too plastic.
Looked at golf gtis, HSV's, subaru sti's, and merc amg's.
Subaru was deadset horrible, the vw didn't do it for me and the HSV was too bogan.
Even took a Audi s5 for a run- the most over rated, tinniest peice of rattly crap I've ever been in.
Very nearly lashed out on a AMG except the salesman was a wanker and made some statements that simply wern't true. Car was okay, but really not good value and outragously expensive to maintain longterm.
In frustration I ended up taking some fords for a testdrive and was gobbsmacked- bought a new supercharged GT with all the toys and absolutely love it- couldn't be happier. Tons of grunt at any speed, brilliant auto, good interior and rides great. Does everything well with no fuss.
Been quite amused by mates who insist that fords are rubbish and I should have bought some highly stressed, overpriced euro barge that would leave you wrecked after a long drive.
have you ever driven a ford focus? holy shit!, worst car I have ever driven since the XF
Just made you angry driving it 😬
Found out my car ain't too bad 👍 drag raced my crap old manual VP v6 against my friends mildly moded VY sv6 and I got in front with my 2k rpm launch (didn't want to blow my diff as its hanging by a thread)
and we stayed lined up until I slowly dropped back by 1/4 car length during gear shifts 😂
lol only lost by 1/4 car length 🤪 yeah I think I'll keep it for some time yet.
71 notchback,
Past owner of, 70 NB, 73 SB and 72 FB TLE
