Skip to content
Aussieveedubbers

Best budget track car?

0 likes
Share Share on Facebook Share on X Share on Reddit
Log in to reply

pete wood 23 Windows of Awesome

6,828 posts · joined Jan 2004 ·

#924185
In a bit of change over with my buggy selling and the like at the mo. I'm also turning 40 next year and you know how it is, you start to think, "better do a few things or I'm gonna kick myself later".

So, I'm thinking about broaching the subject of a race car with the missus. Budget is the big thing. Ie. there's very little cash at the mo. However, I can weld, paint, assemble, fab so it should be ok. What I'm thinking is something that could do motorkhanas, track days and maybe some sort of low cost race series later on. Something my kids can learn to drive in too.

So here are my qus.
1. which model? (want least weigh/best handling options)
2. which motor?
3. which class/race series?
4. key/major costs?

My current thinking is leaning towards a late 1300 beetle with BJ/SA and sticking as close to 1600cc as pos to stay in the under 1600 class for IPRA. What do you all reckon?
"stoopid is stronger than axles"
http://drivingnotpolishing.blogspot.com.au/

Bizarre Moderator The artist formerly known as blue74l

12,789 posts · joined Aug 2002 ·

#924186
an L bug
Futue te ipsum!!!

1303Steve Scirocco Rare

8,650 posts · joined Aug 2002 ·

#924188
Bizarre wrote:an L bug
x2

Craig Torrens 6 times Australian, 7 times State Hillclimb Class Champion

8,040 posts · joined Jan 2003 ·

#924189
I have what youre looking for for sale....I have sent you a PM. 😎


beetleboyjeff Custom Title Time!

1,790 posts · joined Feb 2009 ·

#924191
Bizarre wrote:an L bug
X3
From your ole' mate Jeff

cnfabo Custom Title Time!

1,353 posts · joined Apr 2008 ·

#924242
Why ipra pete. You would need a beast of a engine just to stay at the back of the pack in ipra series.

Craig Torrens 6 times Australian, 7 times State Hillclimb Class Champion

8,040 posts · joined Jan 2003 ·

#924262
^^ 😂


BiX Veteran Volks Folk

2,499 posts · joined Sep 2002 ·

#924264
L bug if you want to stay VW, but I would be looking outside of the VW stable.

The Excel's have a rally series in each state, and also some states have track series. The specs are similar. The rally cars come from 4k to 12k depending on specs, but for about 7k you can get one fully caged and prepped with decent suspension. Not the fastest, but easy to repair, if you blow the engine $500 at the wreckers get you a new enginer and spare panels etc......

I have been looking at selling my half built L bug and going the excel or import route..... far cheaper.
I have no sympathy for my car, only the wallet that pays for it!
Go hard or go home!!!!

pete wood 23 Windows of Awesome

6,828 posts · joined Jan 2004 ·

#924287
cnfabo wrote:Why ipra pete. You would need a beast of a engine just to stay at the back of the pack in ipra series.
Well, IPRA isn't just a race series. Lots of hillclimb guys run that class too. And there are many ways to skin a cat, or in this case, build a beast. IPRA allows you lots of freedoms for a light pre-86 car. I've looked around and it seems it's not all that hard to build a reliable turbo engine that would make over 200hp with mostly stock internals. So that's a real option down the track if I want.

BiX; I know what you mean. I've looked into that in the past. Two things stop me.
1. I'd love a rally car and an excel is the pick as you say, but I just don't have time to do a rally even semi regularly. I literally get 4 sundays off a year and that's it.
2. I like beetles and I know how to make them handle. And parts are pretty cheap for them compared to a lot of other stuff. Yes, the engines are not high HP, but that forces you to really drive and driving is what I'm in it for.
"stoopid is stronger than axles"
http://drivingnotpolishing.blogspot.com.au/

pete wood 23 Windows of Awesome

6,828 posts · joined Jan 2004 ·

#924290
Just BTW, before I posted this question, I went through ebay motor section starting from 0.99c to see what was available, race-able and cheap. In the end I came back to beetle for a few more reasons; They are; still insanely cheap, light, not as given to rust as most things their age, popular, everywhere, easy to find cheap hot-up bits, rear wheel drive and classic. Everything I liked the look of was either Italian, German, rusty, finicky and or $10k plus. Plus, I know a stack of people who know how to build hot beetles and you can always sell them off easily if you need to. So yeah, there will be no GTi, SRi, Vtec or 16v badges on the side, but I know what I'm getting. 😉

And just so as you know, a series 1 RX7 or BMW 2002 would be my next pick... no one wants me to do that. 😂
"stoopid is stronger than axles"
http://drivingnotpolishing.blogspot.com.au/

cnfabo Custom Title Time!

1,353 posts · joined Apr 2008 ·

#924305
Oh,I forgot about the turbo route,good option.

waveman1500 Also rides a Honda

1,346 posts · joined Dec 2009 ·

#924311
This is how I first got into Beetles. I bought my 1500 six years ago for $300 and used it for motorkhanas and khanacross. I started with the stock 1500cc single-port and later upgraded to a stock 1600cc twin-port. I also had 14x6" alloy rims and Monroe GT Gas shocks. Other than that, it was all stock.



They're great if you just want to enjoy competing on a tight budget, but you'll have to spend big money on engine work if you actually want to win at khanacross, rally or hillclimbs. They are competitive in motorkhana though.

Advantages:
Big wheelarches
14" rims are cheap and 14" tyres are cheap. Note that you want to stick to road tyres. If you put rally tyres on, then you will be in the modified class with fully-built rally cars.
You'll be in Class C for motorkhanas, where a Beetle is actually quite competitive.

Disadvantages:
In any racing based on engine size, you'll be thrashed by Datsuns. And Corollas. And Ford Escorts. And everything else. This can be fixed with engine work, but then you'll be spending real money.
1972 VW S-Bug - For Sale!
1968-onwards Beetle panels and glass for sale

Aussie Dubbin Fahrvergnugen

895 posts · joined Jul 2008 ·

#924312
Just think again about carbed turbo. Someone suggested to me that turbo carbed, would be good for starting a stopping all the time but flat out high rpm power.

I would go bj/IRS or strut IRS. If you have a swinger then go for it but If you are choosing... IRS is much more stable. Ring richard at Vforce. He is such a wealth of info. Have a read through my thread below. I could rewrite a lot here, but pm me if you have a few questions

I have hit a build snag in my first child,
'68 BUG build(Racing)
http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=85509
69Baja
http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=88798
Manx(MaxFX)
http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=88799&page=1#pid826884

bugzla Custom Title Time!

1,164 posts · joined Jun 2007 ·

#924314
Go a ROTA ...................... feel the power 🙂

pete wood 23 Windows of Awesome

6,828 posts · joined Jan 2004 ·

#924334
waveman1500 wrote:They're great if you just want to enjoy competing on a tight budget, but you'll have to spend big money on engine work if you actually want to win at khanacross, rally or hillclimbs...
That is true for any car in any class. Wanna win, forget the budget, it's money no object. And in rally, nothing wins unless its AWD or the latest $$$$$$$$$ factory FWD. Everyone else is just competing to finish.

Funny you should say datsuns, coz my car club is full of them. However, the fastest driver in the club, by a country mile drives.... wait for it.... a turboed Mazda 121 bubble car. He's eaten porsches and evos in it. That said, he could be driving a ride-on lawn mower and he'd still win. It's mostly down to skill at club level really...
"stoopid is stronger than axles"
http://drivingnotpolishing.blogspot.com.au/

Craig Torrens 6 times Australian, 7 times State Hillclimb Class Champion

8,040 posts · joined Jan 2003 ·

#924337
following this guys "cheap" fun !



Craig Torrens 6 times Australian, 7 times State Hillclimb Class Champion

8,040 posts · joined Jan 2003 ·

#924346
😂😂......swing axle VW, 1600 with kaddies.......thats what you want !


mactaylor Custom Title Time!

1,005 posts · joined Aug 2007 ·

#924363
In the latest RACE magazine there is a turbo datsun 1200 coupe that is still basically stock 1200 engine that holds a few track records for its class very good read and quite easy to emulate.
EVERLAST CONCRETE TANKS
1800 552 123

pete wood 23 Windows of Awesome

6,828 posts · joined Jan 2004 ·

#924364
Doesn't have to have Kads. But yeah, something like that... as opposed to a horrible, ricey magna. 👎

Mac, I was just reading that and thinking pretty much the same thing. 😎
"stoopid is stronger than axles"
http://drivingnotpolishing.blogspot.com.au/

Joel Now containing 100\% E-Wang

9,368 posts · joined Feb 2006 ·

#924370
Craig Torrens wrote:following this guys "cheap" fun !


Good on the ol boy for getting in there and having a go.

Although seriously? he takes an insurance write off that has been sitting in a holding yard for god knows how long and when nothing electrical works.... A flat battery? for real? GTFO!!!

That's the first thing you'd check.

Oh well good to see he's a believer in the old coldstart redline for a good time for maximum engine life 😎

sander288 "Bolt-on Master"

1,404 posts · joined Aug 2008 ·

#924371
I'd say king pin front and swing axle rear 😏 But if your not into that then a 1302 (L bug???) would be a good start; some great performance parts available off the shelf for this model (KW suspension, bilstein & more)

The king pin beam is stronger and can take more abuse than a ball joint; Andrew Dodd raced successfully with this combo in the 80's

As far as engine goes a turbo motor would be awesome! There is a capacity multiplier though of I think 1.7 so a 1300cc would be counted as a 2184cc if turbo'd which would put it against a bit stiffer competition, also adding a turbo to it when not standard means you'd have to run a restrictor plate

If it was N/A with a 1600 you could defiantly make it scream with some 044 heads, a hot cam, twin carbs and compression for not a great deal of money.
BMW R65 LS
1967 1300 Deluxe
Swing-axles FTW ❗

pete wood 23 Windows of Awesome

6,828 posts · joined Jan 2004 ·

#924395
sander288 wrote:The king pin beam is stronger and can take more abuse than a ball joint; Andrew Dodd raced successfully with this combo in the 80's
Sorry to burst your bubble, but KP beams have two serious issues.
1. camber; it's neutral at best, but even with adjusting the shims, it's almost impossible to get consistent negative camber.
2. trailing arms; they flex and bend under the load of heavy cornering.

Added to all that, it's a nightmare to work on and takes a fitter and machinist to fix properly. Yes, Andrew had success, but really, the guy is a freak. He could race anything and make it work.
"stoopid is stronger than axles"
http://drivingnotpolishing.blogspot.com.au/

Joel Now containing 100\% E-Wang

9,368 posts · joined Feb 2006 ·

#924398
pete wood wrote:Yes, Andrew had success, but really, the guy is a freak. He could race anything and make it work.
Ha, now ain't that the truth.

A few members on here will remember back a few years ago coming back from Dorrigo on the freeway when he dissapeared into the distance in that ratty brown split window beetle.
I saw with my own eyes it looks just like a stock 1100 25hp, just secretly Doddified 😂

1303Steve Scirocco Rare

8,650 posts · joined Aug 2002 ·

#924402
Hi

Who remembers Doddy running around Raleigh in his blue T3 parts getter, it was like watching a ballerina

Steve

sander288 "Bolt-on Master"

1,404 posts · joined Aug 2008 ·

#924407
has no-one seen Paul Mantiet run in his Rapier vee? Link-pin front; negative camber and on top of the Vee championship - but yeah with some maintenance considerations

But the beam front axle is never going to be better than the struts (IMO), big brother wouldn't have moved on if it was
BMW R65 LS
1967 1300 Deluxe
Swing-axles FTW ❗