Wheel alignment

vwrallycar Insano Dub Head

721 posts · joined Sep 2002 · 1 Jul 2014, 8:46 pm

#994658

Hi all, I'm after so help/advice on wheel alignment info others are using for race or circuit use. I'm using my ball joint/IRS beetle for motorkhana/khanacross, all bitumen, and it handles poorly. I don't have anyone I've found here that can setup the front for me in terms of camber/caster etc. Last I had it done was by pedders, and now have positive camber. Anyone have some settings they use they'd be willing to share as well as sway bar sizes etc?
Also ride heights?
Thanks for any help
Andrew

cnfabo Custom Title Time!

1,353 posts · joined Apr 2008 · 1 Jul 2014, 10:43 pm

#994670

Ah man just wrote a long thingy then DELETE!!!!doh

Welcome to AVD Andrew....

Is your beetle a stockie??

Fabo...

cnfabo Custom Title Time!

1,353 posts · joined Apr 2008 · 2 Jul 2014, 10:50 am

#994691

just read re read your first post and now assuming its a stock as a rock beetle....not knowing how much you want to spend..
u could start by lowering the rear to achieve 1.5-2 deg neg camber and the front ad some castor shims under the lower beam and some extra accentric nut on the top ball joint so you can get some neg camber...you will need some adjusters in the beam to lower it also.....so here is a start....also some good shocks too....you can get good bilsteins off eshocks.com..
oh and some new red bushings for the spring plates...
sway bars you could get some non adjustable ones to start off with....

as for a wheel alignment, maybe start from a stock setup then go from there......i run around 3mm total toe in on the rear and about 2-4mm total toe out on the front ,yet to play with the front setting.....

a few other hillclimb boys might chime in eventially...but the above wont cost you much at all..as long as you can do it youself..

this might be confusing to a newby,just let us know...

laters
fabo.....

Aussie Dubbin Fahrvergnugen

895 posts · joined Jul 2008 · 2 Jul 2014, 1:22 pm

#994693

http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=85509

Have a read of my post its pretty long but may give you some help

NOW... I am getting to settings of the suspension and there a differences in what works. Here are two different suggestions comments would be great...
__________________________
FRONT
Discs all round YES
2 Castor shims per side YES
Extra camber adjustor BENT TOP TRAILING ARMS
Anti RB for lowered car
Adjustable shocks set half way
Bridgestone RE720 185/50/15” Tyres NONE YET
Set toe at ride height to ½ deg toe in NOT SET YET

REAR
Discs all round YES
Z-bar adjusted to be “on” full time, not Camber compensator CONVERTED TO IRS
Adjustable shocks set half way
Bridgestone RE720 185/50/15 NONE YET
Set toe at ride height to ½ deg toe in NOT SET YET
__________________________
FRONT
Swayaway adjuster top and bottom YES
2 super eccentric camber adjusters YES
-2 degrees negative camber HOPING FOR UP TO -4*
3-5 degrees castor
5mm toe out (6/32 – 7/32”)
18mm (3/4”) Sway bar
195/60/14” tyres PROB GOING 195 OR 205 X 50X15
Front 1” higher than rear? WENT FOR 28MM REAR T BARS INSTEAD
Cofab/ KYB gas shocks

REAR
Sway away camber compensator IRS
Cofab/ KYB Gas shocks
-2 degrees Camber
2-3mm (3/32 – 1/8”) Toe in
205/60/14 tyres
Shimmed up Z bar
1’ lower than front
__________________________

Brakes????
Car I fit front callipers to the rear as well and have a proportioning valve to bring the bias into play. Nothing worse than having brakes lock up at the front while the car isn’t actually slowing down (recommendations here for handbrake or options otherwise braking great!) PROB LOOKING AT RE BONDING NEW PAD MATERIAL GREEN STUFF OR SIMILAR

So hopefully you can see where I am heading and I would love advice from numerous people in the know please. I also read somewhere about polyurethane boots on the front suspension??? NO

Also as I said above I want to separate the pan get it blasted and powder coated and then commit as many improvements as I can so I have a car that rolls and stops and handles well, anything I have missed would be great.

Thanks Aaron

'68 BUG build(Racing)
http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=85509
69Baja
http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=88798
Manx(MaxFX)
http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=88799&page=1#pid826884

colin Fahrvergnugen

984 posts · joined Mar 2007 · 2 Jul 2014, 9:19 pm

#994722

Is it a daily driver or race only? Will make a huge difference on how you set the car.
Sorry Aussie Dubbin but if you want to transfer more weight to the rear of the car and induce understeer then yes set the front higher than the rear.
The idea of corner weighting a car is to achieve a balance. A VW Beetle is already heavier at the rear so to counterbalance this the front must be lower otherwise you will suffer low speed understeer and high speed oversteer.
Fabo is on the money with his suggestions re toe setting for a race set up.
The most important component of a cars handling is off course the tyres and equally the correct pressures.

Cheers Col

Craig Torrens 6 times Australian, 7 times State Hillclimb Class Champion

8,040 posts · joined Jan 2003 · 2 Jul 2014, 10:43 pm

#994729

cnfabo wrote:Welcome to AVD Andrew....

Andrew has been a member for 12 years.............so the welcome is a tad late 😂😂😂

cnfabo Custom Title Time!

1,353 posts · joined Apr 2008 · 2 Jul 2014, 10:52 pm

#994731

Craig Torrens wrote:
cnfabo wrote:Welcome to AVD Andrew....

Andrew has been a member for 12 years.............so the welcome is a tad late 😂😂😂

My bad😂

Aussie Dubbin Fahrvergnugen

895 posts · joined Jul 2008 · 3 Jul 2014, 1:31 pm

#994761

Cheers Collin,
You're actually racing yours, so I would suggest he takes your advise. Mine is still paperwork chasing.
On a side note im almost out of problems with my car so I can start tuning to suit (been driving for 3 months and had brake bias issue, gen charging issue, fuel pump issue, and window winder issues. now all sorted).
I thinik the extra eccentric camber adjusters are the best bang for your buck part.

'68 BUG build(Racing)
http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=85509
69Baja
http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=88798
Manx(MaxFX)
http://forums.aussieveedubbers.com/viewtopic.php?tid=88799&page=1#pid826884

vwrallycar Insano Dub Head

721 posts · joined Sep 2002 · 3 Jul 2014, 3:58 pm

#994769

Ok sorry it's taken a while to get back.
It's a 1500 ballpoint IRS, lowered front beam, aftermarket camber adjusters, Adjustable koni shocks all round, 17mm bar on the front.
The rear I have just lowered, it was too high, using type 3 rear bars, and NO rear sway bar.
I'm only using street tyres, 195/65/15 on my empi 8's.
Now the only difference to all others is that I have a golf engine in this thing. I used it previously for rallying and it was never a problem, but it's since been rebuilt and restored and have changed the front beam with lowering adjusters.

colin Fahrvergnugen

984 posts · joined Mar 2007 · 3 Jul 2014, 5:58 pm

#994775

Is the golf engine heavier than a beetle engine?
If so your going to need good rear torsion bars to stop the thing from squatting to hard when your accelerate.
Sway Away make excellent quality bars, I run 28mm so use that as a guide.

Cheers Col

vwrallycar Insano Dub Head

721 posts · joined Sep 2002 · 3 Jul 2014, 6:01 pm

#994776

This beetle is purely for racing now, it's way too loud for a daily driver, so I'm not worried about wearing out tyres etc.
I don't run a rear swaybar, as that gives me less traction, that is after handbrake turns.

vwrallycar Insano Dub Head

721 posts · joined Sep 2002 · 3 Jul 2014, 6:06 pm

#994778

Yea the golf engine is heavier, but not a lot, i think it was only 20kgs from memory.
I had the car stock ride height at the front when rallying it and higher than stock in the rear with type 3 bars. I had it a little higher in the rear to allow for the extra weight.
What I'd love is a quaife diff to improve drive and traction out of corners.